>>> DEMOCRATS RALLY IN CHICAGO, AND REDISTRICTING LIKELY HEADS TO COURT AGAIN.

♪♪ >> WELCOME TO "COLUMBUS ON THE RECORD."

OHIO DEMOCRATS MINUS SHERROD BROWN HEAD TO CHICAGO FOR THE DEMOCRATIC NATIONAL CONVENTION NEXT WEEK.

A MONTH AGO THIS MEETING WOULD HAVE LOOKED A LOT DIFFERENT.

JOE BIDEN WAS READY TO ACCEPT THE NOMINATION BUT FACING SERIOUS QUESTIONS ABOUT HIS AGE.

BIDEN'S WITHDRAWAL COULD HAVE MADE THIS CONVENTION VERY MESSY, WITH THE FLOOR FIGHT FOR THE NOMINATION.

DEMOCRATS QUICKLY UNITED BEHIND KAMALA HARRIS, AND FOR NOW THEY ARE EXCITED ABOUT HER PROSPECTS AGAINST FORMER PRESIDENT DONALD TRUMP.

WHEN YOU THINK ABOUT IT, A MONTH, SIX WEEKS AGO, HOW DIFFERENT IS THIS CONVENTION GOING TO BE FROM WHAT IT COULD HAVE BEEN?

>> NIGHT AND DAY FOR SURE.

YOU KNOW, DEMOCRATS ARE GOING INTO THIS CONVENTION ENERGIZED, EXCITED ABOUT WHAT VICE PRESIDENT HARRIS IS GOING TO BRING TO THE PLATFORM -- BRING TO THE CONVENTION IN TERMS OF PLATFORM.

I THINK YOU SEE A VERY UNITED DEMOCRATIC PARTY RIGHT NOW.

AND YOU KNOW, IT'S TAKEN ALL OF THE -- ALL OF THE AIR OUT OF THE BALLOON FOR THE TRUMP CAMPAIGN.

I MEAN, IT'S SPIRALLING RIGHT NOW.

>> SO TERRY, HOW DO REPUBLICANS VIEW THE CONVENTION?

THE REPUBLICAN CONVENTION HAPPENED RIGHT AFTER THE ASSASSINATION ATTEMPT.

THERE WAS -- YOU KNOW, AN INCREDIBLY ODD TIME, SCARY TIME BUT ALSO UNIFYING TIME FOR REPUBLICANS.

HOW DID REPUBLICANS VIEW THIS CONVENTION ON THE DEMOCRATIC SIDE?

>> THEY'RE GOING TO BE LOOKING AT POLICY QUESTIONS BECAUSE THIS WEEK HARRIS HAS ROLLED OUT IDEAS ECONOMICALLY LIKE PRICE CONTROLS, ET CETERA.

AND THEN THERE'S SOME OTHER NEW SPENDING PROGRAM SHE'S COME UP WITH.

SO THE QUESTION IS IS SHE GOING TO TACK TO THE MIDDLE OR GO FARTHER LEFT.

SO I THINK THE MORE THAT THIS IS ABOUT POLICY THE BETTER OFF IT IS.

BUT MY PREDICTION EARLY, ONE OF THEM, IS THE KEY DATE'S GOING TO BE SEPTEMBER 10th.

THAT'S WHEN THE FIRST DEBATE IS.

BY THEN WE'LL BE OVER THE HONEYMOON MAYBE OR PART OF IT FROM THE CONVENTION AND HAIRS BEING NAMED.

SO SEPTEMBER'S GOING TO BE THE BIG TIME WHEN THE ACTION HAPPENS OR DOESN'T.

>> DERRICK, KAMALA HARRIS HAS NOT BEEN ON ANY INTERVIEWS, NOT DONE NEWS CONFERENCES.

IT'S BEEN SCRIPTED SINCE SHE TOOK OVER THE TOP SPOT IN THE TICKET.

SHOULD SHE HAVE DONE MORE PRIOR TO THIS CONVENTIO ?

>> I DON'T THINK SO.

I THINK THE VICE PRESIDENT IS CAPABLE OF ANSWERING ANY QUESTION THAT COMES FROM THE PRESS.

I THINK THAT SHE'S TAKING THIS TIME NOW TO GET REACQUAINTED WITH HER VOTERS.

BEFORE SHE WAS THE VICE PRESIDENT, SHE -- SHE'S THE VICE PRESIDENT NOW, BUT BEFORE SHE WAS JUST THE VICE PRESIDENT THAT WAS RUNNING ON THE TICKET WITH PRESIDENT BIDEN.

NOW SHE'S IN THE DRIVER'S SEAT BEING THE CANDIDATE FOR PRESIDENT, AND QUITE HONESTLY SHE'S TAKING THIS TIME TO GET REACQUAINTED WITH HER VOTERS.

>> SHE'S GOING TO DO AN INTERVIEW AT SOME POINT.

>> SHE WILL DO INTERVIEWS AT SOME POINT.

>> JESSIE, J.D.

VANCE FROM OHIO GOT A STARRING ROLE AT THE REPUBLICAN CONVENTION.

SHERROD BROWN'S NOT GOING TO THIS CONVENTION.

WHAT IS OHIO'S ROLE GOING TO BE IN THE DEMOCRATIC CONVENTION?

MOST PEOPLE BELIEVE DONALD TRUMP HAS THE STATE SEWN UP.

THE LEADING SENATE CANDIDATE'S NOT GOING TO BE THERE.

>> YEAH, IT'S GOING TO BE I THINK IT WILL BE INTERESTING HOW THE HARRIS TICKET IS GOING TO BE DIFFERENT FOR SHERROD BROWN THAN THE BIDEN TICKET WOULD HAVE BEEN.

IT'S HARD, THERE HASN'T BEEN A LOT OF PUBLIC POLLING IN OHIO, BUT I THINK GENERALLY THAT ENTHUSIASM YOU'RE SEEING FOR DEMOCRATS CAN ONLY HELP SHERROD BROWN IN THE STATE OF OHIO.

WHAT HE NEEDS TO DO IS PERFORM WELL WITH BOTH HIS BASE OF DEMOCRATIC VOTERS AND THE CROSSOVER VOTERS.

AND YOU'RE SEEING THAT IN THE ADVERTISEMENTS AND WHO SHERROD BROWN IS SPEAKING, TO THE KIND OF TOPICS THAT SHE'S CHOOSING TO DISCUSS -- HE'S CHOOSING TO DISCUSS.

YOU SAW A LITTLE BIT OF IT FROM TIM RYAN THE LAST CYCLE.

BUT I THINK SHERROD BROWN IS PERHAPS CERTAINLY A MORE SEASONED VETERAN POLITICIAN THAN RYAN.

>> THERE HAS NOT BEEN A LOT OF PUBLIC POLLING.

HE WAS UP BY 4 IN AARP, SHERROD BROWN UP BY FIVE.

OUTSIDE THE MARGIN OF ERROR, BUT NOT MUCH.

IT'S A TIGHT RACE, AND WE -- REMAIN SO THROUGHOUT, YOU THINK?

>> YEAH.

THAT'S A SNAPSHOT IN TIME IN JULY.

I DON'T THINK TOO MANY VOTERS ARE PAYING THAT CLOSE ATTENTION YET ON THE ELECTION.

I THINK THERE'S A LOT OF ROOM IN THERE.

YOU HAVE SOMEONE LIKE SHERROD BROWN WHO I THINK VOTERS KNOW, THEY'RE FAMILIAR WITH HIM, HE'S BEEN ON THE BALLOT FOR YEARS AND YEARS AND YEARS, VERSUS BERNIE MORENO, THIS NEW FIGURE, AND PEOPLE ARE ACCLIMATING AND LEARNING WHAT HE'S ABOUT.

I WOULDN'T PUT TOO MUCH STOCK ONE INTO IT.

>> IF SHERROD'S AHEAD BY FOUR POINTS AFTER HE SPENT LITERALLY TENS OF MILLIONS OF DOLLARS, MINUTE AFTER MINUTE ON TV, HE OUGHT TO BE UP MORE THAN THAT.

AGAIN, IT'S A LONG WAYS.

BY SEPTEMBER IS WHEN PEOPLE START TUNING IN, REAL PEOPLE BUSY IN THE SUMMER WITH THEIR FAMILIES AND VACATIONS.

>> THE NATIONAL REPUBLICAN SENATORIAL COMMITTEE HAS CANCELED $700,000 IN CABLE TV ADS FOR THE FALL.

SHOULD WE READ ANYTHING INTO THAT?

>> NO.

THAT'S CALLED AN INTERNAL SHIFT.

WHEN YOU TAKE IT BY THAT ONE COMMITTEE AT THE HIGHER NONCANDIDATE RATE, IF YOU SWITCH IT AND COMBINE IT WITH THE CANDIDATE YOU GET THE LOWER RATE.

IT'S MORE AN INTERNAL THING.

IT DOESN'T SIGNAL ANYTHING MAJOR SIGNIFICANTLY.

BUT GOOD OR BAD, AS I WARNED THE LAST TIME I WAS HERE, SEPTEMBER IS WHEN -- IF THOUGHT TV IS BAD NOW, WAIT UNTIL SEPTEMBER AND OCTOBER.

>> YES.

THAT AMOUNT -- $700,000 IS ONE QUARTER OF 1% OF WHAT'S GOING TO BE SPENT IN THIS CAMPAIGN.

SO IT'S A DROP IN THE BUCKET.

>> ONLY THING I WAS GOING TO ADD IS THAT SENATOR BROWN, THE VOTERS KNOW HIM.

HE'S BEEN ON THE BALLOT SEVERAL TIMES IN THIS STATE.

AND HE -- BECAUSE HE IS UP AND OUTSIDE OF THE MARGIN OF ERROR RIGHT NOW, YOU KNOW, WITH VICE PRESIDENT HARRIS NOW BEING THE PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE, THAT'S ONLY GOING TO HELP SENATOR BROWN MOVING INTO THE GENERAL ELECTION.

>> DOES THAT HELP THEM IN NORTHEAST OHIO IN PARTICULAR, AFRICAN AMERICAN VOTE, THAT MIGHT COME OUT AND SUPPORT KAMALA HARRIS WHO DIDN'T SUPPORT JOE BIDEN OR HILLARY CLINTON BEFORE?

>> ABSOLUTELY.

WHEN YOU THINK ABOUT THIS ELECTION, THIS IS GOING TO BE ANOTHER HISTORIC ELECTION.

ELECTING THE FIRST AFRICAN AMERICAN INDIAN, JAMAICAN-BORN PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES.

SO THERE'S GOING TO BE A LOT OF MOMENTUM.

THERE'S GOING TO BE A LOT OF FOLKS THAT ARE GOING DO GRASSROOTS CAMPAIGNING FOR THE VICE PRESIDENT.

AND THAT'S ONLY GOING TO HELP THE SENATOR, SENATOR SHERROD BROWN.

>> OKAY.

>>> THE OHIO SECRETARY OF STATE'S OFFICE TOOK SOME CREATIVE LICENSE WHEN THEY ROTE BALLOT LANGUAGE FOR THE PROPOSED REDISTRICTING AMENDMENT.

THE AMENDMENT AIMS TO END GERRYMANDERING BY PUTTING THE PROCESS IN THE HANDS OF AN INDEPENDENT COMMISSION.

HERE'S WHAT VOTERS WILL SEE AS OF RIGHT NOW -- THE PROPOSED AMENDMENT WOULD REPEAL A CONSTITUTIONAL PROTECTION AGAINST GERRYMANDERING, APPROVED BY NEARLY THREE QUARTERS OF HIGH ELECTORS PARTICIPATING IN THE STATEWIDE ELECTIONS OF 2015 AND 2018 AND ELIMINATE THE LONG-STANDING ABILITY OF OHIO CITIZENS TO HOLD THEIR REPRESENTATIVES ACCOUNTABLE FOR ESTABLISHING FAIR STATE LEGISLATIVE AND CONGRESSIONAL DISTRICTS.

THE BALLOT BOARD APPROVED THE LANGUAGE ON FRIDAY, AND THE THREE-PAGE SUMMARY IN A PARTISAN VOTE.

SECRETARY OF STATE FRANK LaROSE SAID HE GENUINELY BELIEVES IT WAS THEIR BEST EFFORT TO TRUTHFULLY SUMMARIZE THE AMENDMENT.

SUPPORTERS OF THE AMENDMENT ARE HOWLING.

THEY SAY THE LANGUAGE IS DESIGNED TO MISLEAD AND DECEIVE THE VOTERS, AND THEY PROMISE TO TAKE THE MATTER TO COURT NEXT WEEK.

JESSIE BALMERT HOW DOES THE SECRETARY OF STATE'S OFFICE JUSTIFY THAT LANGUAGE?

>> YEAH, I THINK WORD MATTER, RIGHT?

LIKE WE CRAFT THEM FOR OUR STORIES.

YOU GUYS WORK ON THEM FOR YOUR VARIOUS CAMPAIGNS.

AND HOW SOMETHING IS WORDED REALLY CAN INFLUENCE LIKE HOW PEOPLE FEEL ABOUT IT.

IT IS TRUE THAT THIS AMENDMENT WOULD REPLACE PRIOR AMENDMENTS THAT HAD SOME REDISTRICTING REFORM MEASURES THAT WE USED LAST YEAR AND THE YEAR BEFORE THAT WERE REPEATEDLY STRIPPED OUT BY THE OHIO SUPREME COURT.

BUT THOSE WERE EFFORTS TO GET AT GERRYMANDERING.

LOT OF IT IS TRUE, BUT HOW ARE YOU READING IT AS THE AVERAGE VOTER IS THE CONCERN OF THE PEOPLE PUTTING FORWARD THIS AMENDMENT.

>> TERRY, IT READS LIKE A NEGATIVE AD.

NEGATIVE ADS ARE TRUE, THEY JUST LEAVE OUT THE FACTS THAT ARE INCONVENIENT.

THIS REALLY READS LIKE AN AD AGAINST THE AMENDMENT.

>> WELL, I'M TELLING YOU, THIS IS LIKE A WARMUP EXHIBITION GAME IN THE SPRING BECAUSE ALREADY THE S SIDE HAS I THINK 17 MILLION IN TV RESERVED, THERE'S GOING TO BE TENS OF MILLIONS MORE.

THIS IS JUST A SMALL LITTLE WARMUP EXERCISE.

BELIEVE ME, BOTH SIDES GOING TO BE ARGUING AND THROWING THINGS BACK AND FORTH.

AND WHEN YOU WRITE AN AMENDMENT THAT'S 13,000 WORDS, THERE'S A LOT OF COMPLEXITY, A LOT OF QUESTIONS IN THERE, INCLUDING ABOUT THEY PROHIBIT PEOPLE FROM BEING ABLE TO TALK TO ANYBODY ON THE COMMISSION OUTSIDE OF THE MEETING, AND PEOPLE WOULD SAY THAT ISN'T QUITE RIGHT AND CONSTITUTIONAL.

>> DO YOU THINK THE LANGUAGE AS PROPOSED ACCURATELY REFLECTS SOMEBODY WHO IS ON -- UNINFORMED GOING INTO VOTING BOOTH?

>> BY ELECTION DAY THEY'RE GOING TO SEE TONS OF TV ADS, THEY GOING TO -- >> IS THE LANGUAGE REFLECTIVE OF WHAT THIS MOMENT WOULD DO?

>> MAUREEN O'CONNOR SAYS NO.

SHE WOULD WRITE IT DIFFERENTLY.

>> WHAT WOULD TERRY CASEY SAY?

>> I MIGHT WRITE IT DIFFERENTLY.

ALSO THE ARGUMENT AT TODAY'S HEARING WAS DOM McIKE SAID WE HIT BULLET POINTS AND 400 WORDS, AND THEY POINTED OUT, YES, BUT YOU FORGOT TO EXPLAIN HOW THE COMMISSION IS GOING TO BE DONE.

HOW MUCH DETAIL DO YOU WANT TO KNOW, HOW MUCH FINE PRINT DO YOU WANT TO READ TO BE DETERMINED.

>> DERRICK, IS THIS -- DOES THIS HELP THIS CAUSE FOR THIS GERRYMANDERING AMENDMENT, OR DOES IT HURT IT?

IT GIVES YOU A FIGHT TO SAY THIS IS HOW THE SYSTEM IS BROKEN.

>> I PROBABLY SHOULD TRADEMARK THIS PHRASE, BUT THIS IS LANGUAGE GERRYMANDERING.

THIS IS WHAT IT IS.

IT'S A VERY DECEPTIVE WAY TO PUT OUT LANGUAGE THAT WOULD CONFUSE VOTERS.

THAT'S BASICALLY WHAT IT'S GOING TO DO.

I BELIEVE IT'S GOING TO BACKFIRE BECAUSE THE YES CAMPAIGN IS GOING TO HAVE THE MONEY TO TALK ABOUT HOW DECEPTIVE THIS LANGUAGE IS, AND THEY WILL BE ABLE TO PUT OUT THE TRUTH OF WHAT -- WHAT THE LANGUAGE IS OR THE BALLOT LANGUAGE IS SUPPOSED TO DO.

>> JAKE, THIS WILL GO TO COURT, THEY PROMISED NEXT WEEK -- AS EARLY AS NEXT WEEK IT COULD BE FILED.

SUPREME COURT LIKELY WILL DECIDE IT.

EVEN IF THE SUPREME COURT THROWS OUT THIS LANGUAGE, HAVEN'T FOLKS WHO OPPOSED THIS AMENDMENT ALREADY SORT OF WON?

WE'RE TALKING ABOUT ALL THIS, IT CAUSES CONFUSION, CAUSES COMPLEXITY.

SOMEBODY WHO'S NOT TUNED IN AS CLOSELY AS OTHERS MIGHT SAY I'M NOT GOING TO VOTE FOR THAT.

>> I WOULDN'T SAY IT'S LOST, BUT THE LANGUAGE AS IS IS A POINT FOR PEOPLE OPPOSED TO THIS AMENDMENT.

I THINK THERE'S ALWAYS GOING TO BE A PRESUMPTION OF VOTING NO AND CHANGING THE CONSTITUTION.

I THINK PEOPLE JUST -- I DON'T KNOW WHO THIS IS, WHAT THIS MEANS.

SO I'M GOING TO SAY NO.

AND I THINK THIS -- IT'S SO LONG THAT I THINK THERE'S -- MORE THAN THAT, YOU READ -- I DON'T WANT TO READ 1,000 VOTES, I'M GOING TO VOTE NO.

I THINK IT'S GOING TO BE A GAME FOR THE PROPONENTS TO REALLY EXPLAIN WHAT THIS DOES AND WIN ON THE MERITS.

THERE'S GOING TO BE NOT JUST A LOT OF MOBILIZING VOTERS, BUT YOU NEED TO TEACH THIS, EXPLAIN TO THEM WHAT THIS IS.

>> WHAT ARE THE CHANCES -- THIS HAPPENED LAST YEAR, JESSIE, WITH THE ABORTION RIGHTS AMENDMENT.

THAT LANGUAGE WAS A LITTLE LOADED, NOT QUITE AS LOADED AS THIS, I THINK OBJECTIVELY.

AND THE SUPREME COURT CHANGED SOME, MADE THEM GO BACK AND REWRITE IT.

>> IT'S POSSIBLE THAT COULD HAPPEN.

THE BALANCE OF THE OHIO SUPREME COURT, THERE ARE FOUR REPUBLICANS, THREE DEMOCRATS.

WE'LL SEE IF THAT PLAYS A ROLE.

FOR YOUR POINT ABOUT THE ABORTION RIGHTS MATTER THAT COULD PASS WITH THE LANGUAGE THAT PEOPLE BACKING THE AMENDMENT DIDN'T LIKE, WERE VERY CONCERNED ABOUT, SO THAT'S ONE POINT IN FAVOR OF MAYBE THIS LANGUAGE DOESN'T MATTER.

ON THE OTHER HAND, PEOPLE REALLY KNOW WHERE THEY STAND ON ABORTION.

REDISTRICTING IS A LITTLE MORE ESOTERIC.

>> I WOULD PREDICT THAT JUSTICE FISHER AND THE OHIO SUPREME COURT, REPUBLICAN FROM CINCINNATI, HE MIGHT BE THE SWING VOTE TO DO SOME FINE-TUNING.

I DON'T THINK THEY'LL THROW IT OUT TOTALLY BECAUSE WHO ON THE SUPREME COURT WANTS TO TRY AND REWRITE IT AND MAKE EVERYBODY HAPPY?

BUT THERE WILL BE SOME FINE-TUNING OF IT.

>> THIS REMINDS ME OF LAST YEAR THAT REPUBLICANS YOU COULD ARGUE KNEW THEY WERE BEHIND -- AGAINST THE PUBLIC OPINION ON THE ABORTION ISSUE.

EVERY POLL HAD A 55-45 SUPPORTING THE ROE STANDARD.

POLLS HAVE SHOWN VOTERS WANT THIS.

IS THIS WHAT REPUBLICANS HAVE TO DO TO WIN?

THEY CAN'T WIN ON THE MERITS, THEY HAVE TO PLAY GAMES WITH THE BALLOT LANGUAGE AND THINGS LIKE THAT?

>> AS JESSIE NOTED PEOPLE KNEW ON ABORTION THEY WERE FOR OR AGAINST IT.

ON THIS, WHAT IS REDISTRICTING, AND THEY'LL MAKE THE ARGUMENT ON TV THAT WE'VE ALREADY HAD TWO AMENDMENTS PASSED WITH70% OF THE VOTERS AND THE LAST THAT WAS UNANIMOUSLY APPROVED.

IS THIS BETTER, WHAT'S IT DO?

THERE'S GOING TO BE A LOT OF ARGUMENTS.

THE DIFFICULTY IS MOST PEOPLE DON'T WALK AROUND THINKING ABOUT REDISTRICTING AND HAVING PREDISPOSED OPINIONS.

>> YEAH.

WE SHALL SEE.

I THINK PEOPLE KNOW MORE ABOUT IT NOW THAN THEY CERTAINLY USED TO.

BUT HOW MANY PEOPLE WILL VOTE ON IT WE'LL SEE.

>>> FIRST ENERGY HAS AGREED TO PAY A $20 MILLION FINE TO SETTLE STATE CHARGES IN THE NUCLEAR BAILOUT SCANDAL.

THE COMPANY HAD ALREADY ADMITTED IT BRIBED FORMER HOUSE SPEAKER LARRY HOUSEHOLDER AND UTILITIES REGULATOR SAM RANDAZO TO GET A $1 BILLION BAILOUT FOR TWO NUCLEAR PLANTS IN NORTHERN OHIO.

IN A BUSINESS FILING, IT WILL CONTINUE TO COOPERATE WITH STATE AND COUNTY PROSECUTORS.

THE COMPANY HAS PAID A $230 MILLION FEDERAL FINE AND FACES EVEN MORE FEDERAL FINES.

JAKE ZUCKERMAN, $20 MILLION IS A LOT OF MONEY TO MOST OF US.

FIRST ENERGY MAKES $13 BILLION A YEAR.

WHY DIDN'T THE STATE GO FOR MORE?

>> THAT'S THE QUESTION, HOW DID THEY LAND ON THE NUMBER.

THE BEST WAY TO EVALUATE THE NUMBER IS PLAY THE GAME OF COMPARISONS.

THERE'S A $4 MILLION BRIBE TO SAM RANDAZO.

SOME WENT TO LARRY HOUSEHOLDER, MUCH OF IT LAWFUL EXPERIENCING, MUCH OF IT WASN'T.

THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT GOT $230 MILLION OUT OF THIS.

FIRST ENERGY EXPECTS TO GIVE $100 MILLION TO THE SEC.

HOW DID THEY GET TO $20 MILLION?

WHY IS THIS SO MUCH LOWER THAN EVERY OTHER REAL ASSESSMENT OF THE WRONGDOING HERE?

AND GAVE YOST HAS NOT ANSWER -- DAVE YOST HAS NOT ANSWERED THAT.

HE'S BEEN ASKED 50 WAYS TO SUNDAY.

>> YESYE, THE STATE -- JESSIE, THE STATE CLAIMS THEY FIRED THE EXECUTIVES, THEY HAVE COOPERATED WITH THE INVESTIGATION, THEY'RE WILLING TO COOPERATE MORE.

THAT'S WHAT THE STATE AND THE COMPANY IS SAYING, THAT'S HOW THEY CAME TO THIS NUMBER, RIGHT?

>> YEAH.

I THINK THE BACKGROUND IS THE STATE HAS FILED CHARGES AGAINST TWO FORMER EXECUTIVES, FORMER CEO CHUCK JONES, AND A VICE PRESIDENT, MICHAEL DOWELING.

AND PART OF THEIR ARGUMENT IN THAT CASE IS THAT FIRST ENERGY WAS LIKE A BIT OF A VICTIM OF THESE INDIVIDUALS' ACTION.

I THINK FOR COOPERATION IN THE PROSECUTION OF THOSE OTHER INDIVIDUALS REALLY PLAYED A ROLE IN THIS ULTIMATE SETTLEMENT.

>> ONE OF THE QUESTIONS IS WILL THERE BE ANY MORE INDICTMENTS BECAUSE IT SEEMS LIKE THE FEDS HAVE NOT SAID NO MORE INDICTMENTS, BUT THEY'VE DONE NOTHING.

AND THE QUESTION IS WERE THERE OTHER LEGISLATORS WHO GOT MONEY OR NOT, AND THEN ALSO IN ALL THESE CRIMINAL CASES YOU'VE GOT TO PROVE CRIMINAL INTENT AND BASED ON RECENT U.S. SUPREME COURT RULINGS, THAT'S A TOUGHER AND HIGHER STANDARD TO REACH.

SO BIG QUESTION, WILL THERE BE ANY MORE INDICTMENTS TO COME.

>> I ACTUALLY AGREE WITH TERRY ON THAT.

ON THAT -- >> SMART GUY.

>> YEAH.

THAT'S THE QUESTION TO SEE IF THERE'S GOING TO BE ANY MORE INDICTMENTS THAT WILL COME FROM THE SCANDAL, AND YOU KNOW, THE $20 MILLION NUMBER, WE MAY NEVER KNOW FULLY WHY THAT NUMBER WAS CHOSEN BY THE ATTORNEY GENERAL.

BUT, YEAH, MORE TO COME ON THAT.

>> AS FAR AS FUTURE INDICTMENTS GO, JAKE, THE STATUTE OF LIMITATIONS FOR FEDERAL CHARGES IS FIVE YEARS.

IT'S BEEN FIVE YEARS SINCE THIS BILL PASSED AND THE CAMPAIGN -- THE FAILED CAMPAIGN TO REPEAL IT HAPPENED.

IT HAPPENED IN THE FALL OF 2019, I THINK SEPTEMBER OF 2019.

SO THE FEDERAL STATUTE OF LIMITATIONS IS UP IN A COUPLE OF WEEKS.

ASSUMING THAT THE CRIMINAL ACTIVITY ENDED WHEN THE CAMPAIGN ENDED.

>> RIGHT.

I'D SAY THE STATUTE OF LIMITATION CAN BE A TERM OF ART SOMETIMES -- I SHOULDN'T SAY TERM OF ART, BUT THERE'S PLAY IN THE JOINTS THERE.

YOU COULD SAY, FOR INSTANCE, THE CONSPIRACY DIDN'T END WHEN THAT BILL PASSED.

THERE WAS STILL A PLAY TO GET LARRY HOUSEHOLDER AROUND TERM LIMITS.

THAT WENT TO MARCH OF 2020.

YOU COULD SAY THAT THE CONSPIRACY -- CONSPIRATORS WERE STILL CONSPIRING AFTER THAT POINT TO GET RID OF EVIDENCE.

SO THERE ARE DIFFERENT THINGS THAT GET TOLD THE STATUTE OF LIMITATIONS, THERE COULD BE DEALS.

I WOULDN'T PUT TOO MUCH STOCK INTO THAT.

IF YOU LOOK AND SAY WHAT HAS THE U.S. ATTORNEY'S OFFICE DONE.

THEY HAVE TWO WITNESSES TO PLEADED GUILTY, THEY HAVEN'T BEEN SENTENCED.

THAT COULD MEAN DIFFERENT THINGS.

IT COULD MEAN THAT THEY ARE STILL COOPERATING, THERE'S STILL A CASE IN PLAY.

THERE HAVE BEEN NO NEW CHARGES.

THEY'VE LET FIRST ENERGY OUT OF THE DEFERRED PROSECUTION AGREEMENT, OUT OF THE BETTER PART AT LEAST.

THERE'S BEEN NO ONE ARRESTED.

THEY'VE ALLOWED THE PUCO TO CONTINUE ITS INVESTIGATIONS.

ALL THIS HAS PLAYED OUT SO VERY PUBLICLY, YOU KNOW.

THERE HAVE BEEN PRESS CONFERENCES, THERE HAVE BEEN UMPTEENTH MEDIA REPORTS.

I THINK IF THE U.S. ATTORNEY WERE GOING DO SOMETHING THEY'D OF DONE SOMETHING.

>> THE STATE HAS SIX YEARS, JESSIE BALMERT, STATUTE OF LIMITATIONS ON NONVIOLENT FELONIES.

WE HAVE ANOTHER YEAR LEFT IF YOU GO BY THE TIMELINE OF 2019.

>> YEAH, WE'LL SEE.

THE OHIO ATTORNEY GENERAL, DAVE YOST, HAS SAID THIS ISN'T A CLOSED INVESTIGATION, BUT HE HASN'T GUARANTEED THAT THERE'S GOING TO BE MORE CHARGES.

SO IT'S ANOTHER ONE OF THOSE QUESTIONS THAT I'D LOVE TO KNOW THE ANSWER TO.

>> YEAH.

WHAT IS YOUR PREDICTION -- YOU PREDICT MORE CHARGES, TERRI?

>> I HAVE NO IDEA.

>> OKAY.

>> BUT THE FACT THAT NOTHING HAS HAPPENED IN THIS MUCH TIME TELLS YOU EITHER THE EVIDENCE -- PARTICULARLY FEDERAL PROSECUTORS, THEY LIKE TO GO INTO COURT ALMOST WITH CONFESSIONS AND VIDEOTAPE.

THEY DON'T LIKE TO LOSES IN A COURTROOM.

SO ANY GOOD PROSECUTOR IF YOU DON'T HAVE THE EVIDENCE, YOU USUALLY DON'T INDICT.

>> HOW ABOUT LETTERS TO SAY YOU DID NOTHING WRONG, THE INVESTIGATION HAS CLEARED YOU?

I'M SURE THERE ARE SOME OFFICIALS WOULD LIKE TO HAVE THIS PUT BEHIND THEM IF THEY'RE GOING TO RUN FOR FUTURE OFFICE.

>> I DON'T THINK THAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN.

BUT AS TO WHETHER THERE WILL BE OTHER INDICTMENTS, THAT REMAINS TO BE SEEN.

YOU KNOW, FROM THIS -- THIS SCANDAL HAS -- IS ONE, THE BIGGEST IN THE UNITED STATES.

I'M NOT SURE IF YOU'RE GOING TO SEE LETTERS THAT ARE GOING TO BE COMING.

>> JAKE?

>> I'LL TELL YOU, THE U.S. ATTORNEY'S ALMOST IN PICKAWAYLE WHEN YOU THINK ABOUT IT -- PICKLE WHEN YOU THINK ABOUT IT.

FIRST ENERGY HAS AGREED TO BRIBING LARRY HOUSEHOLDER AND ANOTHER STATE OFFICIAL.

THOSE STATE -- THE SAM RANDAZA HAS BEEN CHARGED, LARRY HOUSEHOLDER HAS BEEN CHARGED FOR TAKING THAT BRIBE.

NO ONE HAS BEEN ACCUSED OF PAYING IT.

ALL THAT IS NOT ILLEGAL IS LOGICALLY LEGAL.

SO IN CERTAIN WAYS YOU COULD READ THIS AS THE GOVERNMENT SAYING, WAY, PAYING THE BRIBES IS LEGAL.

RECEIVING THEM IS ILLEGAL.

HOW DOES THAT MAKE SENSE, I DON'T KNOW.

BUT IT'S THIS REALLY STICKY WICKET THAT'S UNAVOIDABLE HERE.

>> THE CEO, TWO EXECUTIVES, THEY FACE STATE CHARGES AS OF NOW, NOT FEDERAL CHARGES.

>>> ALL RIGHT.

THE COLUMBUS CITY OFFICIALS CONTINUE TO COPE WITH THE DAMAGE AND THE FALLOUT FROM A CYBERATTACK ON ITS COMPUTER SYSTEMS.

THE SAGA BEGAN A MONTH AGO WHEN A CITY WORKER DETECTED A HACK.

IT DISCONTINUED COMPUTERS FROM THE INTERNET DISRUPTING SERVICES.

A WEEK LATER THE CITY ANNOUNCED IT HAD THWARTED A RANSOMWARE ATTACK BUT SAID SOME DATA WAS AGENCIESED.

THEN A RANSOMWARE GROUP STARTED TO AUCTION OFF CITY DATA ON THE DARK WEB.

BUT MAYOR ANDREW GINTHER HELD A NEWS CONFERENCE AND SAID MOST OF THAT DATA, MOST OF THAT STOLEN DATA WAS USELESS.

>> IN THIS SITUATION ON FRIDAY, I CAN SHARE THAT PERSONAL DATA THAT THE THREAT ACTOR PUBLISHED TO THE DARK WEB WAS EITHER ENCRYPTED OR CORRUPTED.

SO THE MAJORITY OF THE DATA CAME BY THE THREAT ACTOR IS UNUSABLE.

>> THAT WAS NOT ACCURATE.

A PRIVATE INVESTIGATOR CLAIMED THE DATA WAS AVAILABLE.

IT INCLUDED NAMES, ADDRESSES, AND SOCIAL SECURITY NUMBERS.

THE INVESTIGATOR SAYS CLOSE TO A HALF MILLION PEOPLE WERE INCLUDED IN THE LEAK, INCLUDING ANYONE WHO USED A DRIVER'S LICENSE TO ENTER CITY HALL, AND POSSIBLY CRIME VICTIMS.

TERRY CASEY, THESE DATA BREACHES AND HACKS AND RANSOMWARE ATTACKS HAPPEN ALL THE TIME.

THE CITY HAS NOT HANDLED THIS PERFECTLY.

WHAT ARE YOUR THOUGHTS ON THIS?

>> WELL, IT IS A MESS, AND WHEN YOU'RE THE MAYOR AND YOU SAY SOMETHING TUESDAY MORNING AND IT'S IMMEDIATELY REFUTED ON TUESDAY AFTERNOON, THAT'S BAD.

AND JUST NOW PEOPLE ARE DISCOVERING AND THERE'S QUESTIONS OF WHEN YOU PAY YOUR WATER BILL OR SET UP TO HAVE THAT TAKEN OUT OF YOUR BANK ACCOUNT OR YOU'RE DOING OTHER KIND OF THINGS INCLUDING YOUR INCOME TAX FILINGS, HOW PROTECTED ARE YOUR SOCIAL SECURITY NUMBERS AND OTHER THINGS BECAUSE CITY HALL DOES HAVE A LOT OF MONEY.

AND THERE'S SERIOUS QUESTIONS ON CRIME VICTIMS, WOMEN WHO WERE UNDER PROTECTIVE ORDERS.

SO UNFORTUNATELY THE MAYOR AND CITY HALL HAS NOT BEEN FORTHCOMING.

>> THIS IS GOING TO BE STUDIED BY A THINK CRISIS MANAGEMENT FOLKS FOR A WHILE.

BUT THE CITY CLAIMS THAT THEY DIDN'T WANT TO AGITATE THE CRIMINALS WHO WERE THREATENING TO RELEASE THE DATA.

THEY SAID THERE WAS AN -- A FEDERAL INVESTIGATION OR STATE INVESTIGATION, DIDN'T WANT TO INTERFERE WITH THAT.

COULD THE CITY HAVE BEEN MORE UP FRONT, DERRICK?

>> OF COURSE THEY COULD HAVE BEEN MORE UP FRONT.

THE BOTTOM LINE IS THESE CALL TO ALL GOVERNMENTS BECAUSE EVEN THOUGH THESE TYPE OF CYBERATTACKS HAPPEN OFTEN AND IN A NUMBER OF DIFFERENT CIRCLES, YOU KNOW, YOU'RE STARTING TO SEE THEM HAPPEN MORE AND MORE IN GOVERNMENT.

SO IT'S GOING TO HAVE -- I THINK THE I.T.

DEPARTMENTS OF THESE CITIES AND COUNTIES AND EVEN THE STATE ARE GOING TO HAVE TO REALLY BE LOOKING AT HOW THEY -- HOW THEY PROTECT THEIR DATA.

>> AND I WOULD ARGUE THAT THE PEOPLE IN COLUMBUS MISSED THE WAKE-UP CALL BECAUSE IN MID JUNE THE CITY OF CLEVELAND GOT HIT WITH A SIMILAR THING.

THE MAYOR THERE WAS MORE FORTHCOMING, THE CITY HALL WAS ALMOST SHUT DOWN FOR A WEEK.

HERE IN COLUMBUS, WE SHOULD HAVE REALIZED IF IT HIT CLEVELAND IT COULD REACH COLUMBUS.

>> COLUMBUS DID SHUT DOWN CITY HALL FOR A WEEK.

EMAIL ADDRESSES -- YOU COULDN'T GET THROUGH, THE 311 LINE WAS DONE.

THEY HAD TO WRITE NOTES.

>> TO CLAIM NO ONE WAS AT RISK AND THERE WAS NO PROBLEM WHEN TV ANCHORS GO ON THE SCREEN AND SAY MY SOCIAL SECURITY NUMBER HAS BEEN PUT ON THE DARK WEB, THAT'S NOT A GOOD SIGN.

>> I'M GUESSING THAT MAYOR GINTHER HAD BAD WORDS TO TELL PEOPLE AFTER HE FOUND OUT THAT WHAT HE SAID WAS NOT ACCURATE, JESSIE.

>> YEAH, YEAH.

AND I THINK REALLY THE FOCUS SHOULD BE ON THE PEOPLE, THE POTENTIAL VICTIMS OF CRIME, THE INDIVIDUALS WHO ARE JUST INTERACTING WITH THE CITY TRYING TO PAY THEIR BILLS, TRYING TO GET A PARKING PASS WHO NOW HAVE INFORMATION OUT THERE.

SO WHAT DOES THE CITY, WHAT CAN SERVICES BE OFFERED SO THAT PEOPLE'S PERSONAL INFORMATION IS NOT OUT THERE ON THE WEB.

AND I -- YOU KNOW, THAT'S I THINK WHERE THE CITY SHOULD BE FOCUS ISSING ITS ATTENTION.

>>ACHE -- FOCUSING ITS ATTENTION.

>> JAKE, I'VE GOTTEN TWO LETTERS IN THE PAST YEAR SAYING TWO OF THE ORGANIZATIONS I DO BUSINESS WITH WERE COMPROMISED, AND THEY'RE GOING TO SET UP CREDIT MONITORING FOR ME.

TWICE IN THE PAST YEAR.

OKAY, THIS IS -- YOU JUST WE'LL DO IT, I GUESS.

>> YEAH.

I'VE GOTTEN THESE, IT SEEMS LIKE IT'S A FACT OF LIFE IN THE 21st CENTURY.

IT'S UNBELIEVABLE HOW MANY DEVICES OR SIGN-INS NEED TO BE PAIRED WITH OTHER DEVICES AND SIGN-INS AND THEN YOU GET ONE, YOU SEEM TO GET THE WHOLE WEB.

>> AND ON THE EMAILS, YOU GET EMAILS FROM PEOPLE SAYING YOUR PAYMENT'S BEEN DENIED AND YOU NEED TO CALL THIS NUMBER.

AND THAT'S TRICKSTERS TRYING TO GET YOUR INFORMATION.

>> SOMETHING I'D ADD HERE, THOUGH, IS WHAT JUMPED OUT TO ME IN THESE STORIES IS THE -- NOT THE KILLERS, THE DATA-TAKERS, THEY DIDN'T WANT U.S.

DOLLARS.

THEY WANTED BITCOIN.

THIS IS THIS INDUSTRY THAT'S TRYING TO LEGITIMIZE ITSELF AND HERE THEY ARE DOING CRIMES ASKING FOR RANSOM IN BITCOIN.

>>> LET'S GET TO THE OFF-THE-RECORD PARTING SHOTS.

DERRICK?

>> LOOKS LIKE CONSTRUCTION HAS STARTED OR AT LEAST PRE-CONSTRUCTION HAS STARTED OUT AT THE JOHN GLENN INTERNATIONAL AIRPORT FOR A BRAND NEW AIRPORT TERMINAL THAT SHOULD BE COMPLETE BY 2028, 2029.

>>> I WANT TO GIVE A SHOUT OUT TO THE NEW OSU QUARTERBACK WILL HOWARD BECAUSE MY BROTHER-IN-LAW LIVES IN KANSAS NEAR THE KANSAS STATE CAMPUS.

THE PAST THREE YEARS WE FOLLOWED WILL HOWARD.

HE'S THE REAL DEAL.

HE'S GOT THE MATURITY, THE EXPERIENCE, THE SPEED, THE PASSING.

IT'S GOING TO BE AN EXCITING FALL.

>> WE'LL SEE.

JAKE?

>>> DROVE PAST MIDDAY ON THE WAY SPECIFICALLYING OUT THE BAR AT 3 P.M. >> COLLEGE STUDENTS ARE BACK.

>>> HEADED TO THE DEMOCRATIC NATIONAL CONVENTION TO COVER THE PEOPLE THERE.

I'M ACCEPTING TIPS ON STORIES OR DEEP DISH PIZZA.

>> AH.

HAVE TO THINK ABOUT THAT.

I DO PREDICT, AS JESSIE HEADS TO THE DEMOCRATIC NATIONAL CONVENTION, THAT THERE WILL BE AT LEAST ONE CAT HELD LIKELY BY A WOMAN ON STAGE AT THE DEMOCRATIC NATIONAL CONVENTION JUST LIKE WHAT WAS THE DOG'S NAME?

>> BABY DOG.

>> BABY DOG.

AT THE REPUBLICAN CONVENTION.

THAT'S MY PREDICTION.

THAT IS "COLUMBUS ON THE RECORD" FOR THIS WEEK.

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FOR OUR CREW AND PANEL, I'M MIKE THOMPSON.

HAVE A GOOD WEEK.

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