>>> HELLO EVERYONE AND WELCOME TO AMANPOUR & COMPANY.

HERE IS WHAT IS COMING UP.

>> ISRAEL AND IRAN INTENSIFIED THEIR ATTACK AS G7 LITERS MEET IN CANADA.

WHERE'S THE CONFLICT HEADED?

I ASKED VETERAN U.S.

DIPLOMAT RICHARD HAAS.

>> THIS CANNOT BE THE NORM.

IT CANNOT BE THE WAY WE DEAL WITH POLITICAL DIFFERENCES.

>> IN ONE WEEKEND, A MINNESOTA LAWMAKER AND HER HUSBAND ARE SHOT DEAD.

NO KINGS RALLIES AND PRESIDENT TRUMP POST THE LARGEST MILITARY PARADE WASHINGTON D.C. HAS SEEN IN DECADES.

WE HAVE MORE ON THE POLITICAL ATMOSPHERE OF THE COUNTRY AND ITS REAL-WORLD IMPACT.

>> IT IS ANGUISH THAT NO ONE CAN IMAGINE IN THIS WORLD.

IT HAS BEEN GOING ON.

>> LIFE AND DEATH IN GAZA WORK THIS PULITZER PRIZE WINNING WRITER TELLS US HOW IT FEELS TO WIN THE AWARD FROM HIS WORK DOCUMENTING IT.

>> AMANPOUR & COMPANY IS MADE POSSIBLE BY THE ANDERSON FAMILY ENDOWMENT, JIM ATWOOD AND LESLIE WILLIAMS, CAN LET US KING WIER PROGRAMMING ENDOWMENT TO FIGHT ANTI-SEMITISM.

THE FAMILY FOUNDATION OF LAYLA AND MICKEY STRAUSS, MARK GLESSNER, THE PHILIP D'AGOSTINO FOUNDATION, SETON MELVIN, THE PETER G PETERSON AND JOEY COONEY FUND.

CHARLES ROSENBLUM, BRIDGING CULTURAL DIFFERENCES AND OUR COMMUNITIES.

BARBARA ZUCKERBERG, JEFFREY CATS AND BETH ROGERS.

AND BY CONTRIBUTIONS TO YOUR PBS STATION FROM VIEWERS LIKE YOU.

THANK YOU.

>> WELCOME TO THE PROGRAM EVERYONE.

I AM IN SITTING IN FOR CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR.

IRAN TELEVISION SAID THEY HAVE BEEN ATTACKED BY ISRAEL.

THIS VIDEO SHOWING A TELEVISION ANCHOR ON AIR AS THE STATION APPEARS TO BE HIT IN REALTIME.

ISRAELI ISRAELI PRIME MINISTER BENJAMIN NETANYAHU SAID HIS COUNTRY'S AIR FORCE CONTROLS THE SKIES OVER THE IRAN CASUAL CITY CAPITAL CITY.

224 PEOPLE HAVE BEEN KILLED IN IRAN.

ISRAEL, 24.

SATELLITE IMAGES SHOWING THE DAMAGE TO ONE IRANIAN FACILITY.

IN TEL AVIV, THIS VIDEO SHOWS EMERGENCY WORKERS AT THE SITE OF AN IRANIAN MISSILE STRIKE RIGHT NOW, WORLD LEADERS ARE MEETING IN CANADA FOR THE G7 SUMMIT WHERE THERE IS DISUNITY OVER A JOINT STATEMENT ON IRAN.

BRING IN CHRISTIANE FOR HER REACTION AND ANALYSIS ON THIS INTENSE MOMENT.

THIS IS THE STATE OF PLAY.

I'M HERE FILLING IN FOR YOU BUT WE ARE GETTING YOUR EXPERTISE THIS IS A CONFLICT YOU HAVE BEEN COVERING FOR DECADES AND I'M CURIOUS TO GET YOUR ASSESSMENT OF WHERE THINGS STAND.

I JUST SPOKE WITH A FORMER ISRAELI DEFENSE MINISTER AND IT WAS HIS FIRST INTERVIEW WITH UNITED STATES MEDIA.

HE SAID, IN HIS WORDS, THAT THE U.S. HAS AN OBLIGATION TO HELP ISRAEL'S OPERATION AND IRAN RIGHT NOW.

>> I'M ON ASSIGNMENT ELSEWHERE BUT ALSO ON THE STORY.

I'M HAPPY TO JOIN.

THAT IS ONE OF THE BIG QUESTIONS, WILL THE U.S. GET INVOLVED?

I UNDERSTAND FROM MY REPORTING THAT THE U.S. IS, IN SOME WAY, INVOLVED IN HELPING ISRAEL DEFLECT THESE AND COMING FROM IRAN.

THAN IT WAS IN OCTOBER.

THE UNITED STATES IS NOT SAYING THAT VERY PUBLICLY.

CERTAINLY, ISRAEL DOES NOT HAVE THE SAME AMOUNT OF ALLIES THAT IT DID IN OCTOBER AND NOVEMBER.

NONE OF THE ARAB STATES OR THE OTHER G7 OR OTHER MEMBERS ARE INVOLVED IN HELPING ISRAEL DEFLECT ANY INCOMING.

THAT IS BECAUSE THE U.S. IS THE ONLY COUNTRY THAT IS OUT WITH THESE SUPPORTING ISRAEL.

AND AT THE G7, ALL THE PARTNERS WANTED DE-ESCALATION.

YOU HAVE BENJAMIN NETANYAHU, GIVEN WHAT THEY SAID TO YOU, WANTING TO DRAW THE UNITED STATES IN.

THE QUESTION IS, WILL TRUMP BE DRAWN IN?

THE OTHER QUESTION, GIVEN WHAT YOU JUST REPORTED AND WHAT WE HAVE SEEN, USING STATE MEDIA AND TALKING ABOUT CIVILIANS OF ACCURATE --EVACUATING, AND SEEING THEY DO HAVE CONTROL OF THE SKIES AND THEY HAVE PRACTICALLY FOR THE BEGINNING OF THIS, WHAT IS THE ACTUAL SUBTEXT OF THIS?

IS IT JUST TO DAMAGE AND SETBACK AND IF THEY CAN, DESTROY THE NUCLEAR SITUATION THERE AND THE MILITARY TARGETS?

OR IS IT REGIME CHANGE?

THEY ARE VIGOROUSLY SAYING IT IS NOT REGIME CHANGE.

BUT THE EVIDENCE SUGGESTS OTHERWISE THERE ARE MANY TARGETS SINCE FRIDAY THAT HAVE NOT BEEN NUCLEAR RELATED.

BUT VERY MUCH LEADERSHIP RELATED.

YOU ALSO HAVE THAT REPORTING.

I DON'T KNOW IF IT IS CONFIRMED YET THAT TRUMP APPARENTLY VETOED THE SUPREME LEADERS AND BEING ON ONE OF THE ORIGINAL HIT LISTS.

THERE IS THE FEELING, INCLUDING WHAT BENJAMIN NETANYAHU HIMSELF TOLD FOLKS ON FOX NEWS THIS WEEKEND IS THAT THIS MAY HELP IRANIANS RISE UP AGAINST THE REGIME AND YOU ALSO HEARD THE ISRAELI PRESIDENT TELL CNN THAT AFTER BACKING OFF AND SAYING, NO.

THE REGIME CHANGE IS NOT OUR GOAL.

IT APPEARS TO BE, IN THE BACK OF THEIR MIND.

IS.

EVERYONE IS CALLING THE DE-ESCALATION.

BUT THERE DOES NOT SEEM TO BE ANY OFFRAMP.

THE U.S., TRUMP IS NOT PRESSURING ISRAEL.

BENJAMIN NETANYAHU APPEARS TO BE IN CHARGE OF THE MISSION AND HE HAS MADE A DIRECT HIT ON THE DIPLOMATIC PART BY KILLING ALI WHO USED TO BE IN THE MILITARY AND IS POLITICAL AID TO THE LEADER.

AND WAS A DIRECTOR OF THE CURRENT NEGOTIATIONS.

BY KILLING HIM, THEY HOPE TO KILL OFF ANY DIPLOMATIC RESOLUTION.

BECAUSE HILTY NEVER WANTED A DIPLOMATIC SOLUTION.

HE DOES NOT BELIEVE IN IT.

AND HE WAS FUNDAMENTAL AND INSTRUMENTAL IN CAUSING PRESIDENT TRUMP TO WITHDRAW FROM THE NUCLEAR AGREEMENT BETWEEN THE U.S., IRAN AND THE REST OF THE WORLD.

>> ALSO, CHRISTIANE WITH MY COME TO THE POINT YOU RAISED AND IT WAS REPORTED THAT THE PRESIDENT VETOED AN ASSASSINATION OF THE SUPREME LEADER.

WHEN I ASKED HIM HIS THOUGHTS ON THAT AND WHETHER THAT WAS A MISTAKE, HE SAID, "ALL OPTIONS ARE ON THE TABLE."

AND TO THE POINT OF POTENTIAL REGIME CHANGE IN THE COUNTRY, WHETHER THAT WAS INDEED ONE OF ISRAEL'S TARGETS, HE SAID, "I'M NOT RESISTING.

I'M SUPPORTING A CHANGE OF REGIME IN IRAN BUT A LOT OF IT HAS TO BE DONE BY THE IRANIAN PEOPLE AND NOT BY US AND NOT BY AMERICA."

THAT SEEMS TO BE THE LINE WE ARE HEARING FROM THIS GOVERNMENT.

I INTERVIEWED A FOREIGN MINISTER YESTERDAY AND HE WAS SAYING SOMETHING SIMILAR ABOUT THAT, THAT THEY WOULD NOT BE DISAPPOINTED IN A REGIME CHANGE BUT THIS IS SOMETHING THAT WOULD HAVE TO BE DONE BY THE IRANIAN PEOPLE.

WHAT ARE YOU HEARING?

>> THAT MEANS THAT THEY HOPE THAT THEY CAN FACILITATE AND ENABLE IRANIAN PEOPLE, TO RISE UP.

THERE IS NO DOUBT THAT A HUGE MAJORITY OF THE IRANIAN PEOPLE WANT TO SEE A DIFFERENT GOVERNMENT.

THEY WANT FREEDOM.

THEY WANT TO BE ABLE TO AFFORD THEIR DAILY GROCERIES, SCHOOLS AND ENERGY COSTS.

ALL THE SAME THINGS EVERYBODY ELSE WANTS.

AND THE SANCTIONS AND THE IRANIAN MISMANAGEMENT OF THE ECONOMY OVER DECADES.

THE MASSIVE SANCTIONS HAVE MADE THAT VERY DIFFICULT.

THE IRANIAN PEOPLE ARE UNDER HUGE PRESSURE.

BUT WHEN YOUR COUNTRY IS ATTACKED, IS WHAT I'M HEARING FROM A LOT OF PEOPLE INSIDE, BY A FOREIGN POWER, IT MAKES YOU LESS ABLE AND LESS WILLING TO GO OUT IN THE STREETS AND RALLY AROUND, IN THIS CASE, THE ISRAELI FLAG.

INSTEAD, ACCORDING TO MY SOURCES, WHO I HAVE BEEN TALKING TO THE LAST FEW DAYS, IN THEIR WORDS, THERE IS A SURPRISING CONSOLIDATION OF RALLYING AROUND THE IRANIAN FLAG.

NATION EVEN IF THEY DON'T NECESSARILY BELIEVE IN THE CURRENT GOVERNMENT.

THAT IS ONE ISSUE.

WE DON'T KNOW HOW THAT WILL PAN OUT.

WHAT WE DO KNOW IS THAT UP UNTIL NOW, EVERY TIME THE IRANIAN PEOPLE HAVE DEMONSTRATED THEIR DESIRE FOR CHANGE, WHETHER IT WAS IN THE UPRISING KNOWN AS WOMEN, LIFE, FREEDOM, WHICH BY THE WAY, BENJAMIN NETANYAHU SAID, MAKE THAT WHAT YOU WILL.

HE URGED THEM TO TAKE THAT TO HEART.

BUT THEN, AND IN THE 2009 GREENROOM RESOLUTION ONE PEOPLE CAME INTO THE STREETS, THE REGIME SHOWED NO MERCY IN CRACKING DOWN.

THEY STILL HAVE THE ABILITY.

SO THAT IS THE REALITY OF WHAT IS HAPPENING ON THE GROUND RIGHT NOW.

IF ANY NATION OR PEOPLE OR FACTION CAN TURN THE MILITARY OR THE ISLAMIC REVOLUTIONARY GUARD CORPS, MAYBE THAT IS A DIFFERENT THING.

BUT AT THE MOMENT, AND WE DON'T KNOW WHAT WILL HAPPEN NEXT BUT AT THE MOMENT, IT APPEARS THEY ARE MOSTLY SCARED AND THEY ARE STAYING IN THEIR HOUSES AND, BECAUSE INCLUDING THE REGIME TARGETS THEY HAVE GOT, AND I KNOW THIS BECAUSE I TALKED TO SOMEONE WHO LOST A RELATIVE, BUILDINGS HAVE COME DOWN AS WELL.

AND THOSE BUILDINGS ARE ALSO CIVILIANS.

AND THERE ARE A LOT OF INJURIES AND DEATH.

AND IRAN HAS DOES NOT HAVE THIS SITUATION SINCE THE IRAQ WAR, SINCE SADDAM HUSSEIN INVADED IRAN.

THAT IS THE COMPLICATED SITUATION ON THE GROUND.

>> THE EIGHT YEAR WAR THAT LOST ABOUT A MILLION LIVES THERE UNTIL ULTIMATELY THE SUPREME LEADER SAID THAT HE WAS FORCING HIMSELF TO DRINK POISON TO BRING THAT TO AN END AND NOBODY WANTS TO SEE A WAR GO ON LIKE THAT WITH THE DEATH TOLL IN THOSE NUMBERS.

CHRISTIANE, I KNOW YOU WILL CONTINUE TO FOLLOW-UP WITH YOUR SOURCES AND BRING US ANY REPORTING YOU HAVE.

US IN THE DAYS AND WEEKS TO COME.

THANK YOU SO MUCH.

GREAT TO HAVE YOU ON YOUR PROGRAM HERE.

>> THANK YOU.

>> FOR MORE ON HOW THE U.S. IS NAVIGATING ITS RESPONSE TO THIS, DICK HAS HAD VARIOUS SENIOR ROLES IN THE U.S. STATE DEPARTMENT AND AS PRESIDENT OF THE COUNCIL ON FOREIGN RELATIONS AND IS JOINING ME LIVE FROM NEW YORK.

RICHARD, I WANT TO GET TO THE QUESTION OF WHAT ULTIMATELY THE U.S. ROLE WILL BE HERE IF, IN FACT, AS WE HEARD, IT WILL REQUIRE THE UNITED STATES TO FINISH THE JOB.

LET'S PLAY THE SOUND OF WHEN I ASKED HIM ABOUT THAT, SPECIFICALLY GOING AFTER ONE OF THE NUCLEAR SITES THAT MOST EXPERTS BELIEVE ISRAEL CANNOT TAKE OUT UNILATERALLY.

>> AGAIN, GIVEN THE HIGH LEVEL OF MEETINGS THAT YOU HAVE HAD WITH U.S. OFFICIALS IN YOUR TIME AS MINISTER OF DEFENSE, AND GIVEN THE AMOUNT OF TIME THAT YOU PARTICIPATED IN PLANNING FOR THIS OPERATION THEN THAT THIS WOULD NOT HAVE HAPPENED, ISRAEL WOULD NOT HAVE LAUNCHED THIS WAR WITHOUT THE COMMITMENT THAT THE UNITED STATES, IF NEED BE, WOULD JOIN AS WELL?

IS THE ULTIMATE GOAL HERE TO ELIMINATE IRAN'S NUCLEAR PROGRAM WITH THE UNITED STATES ASSISTING ISRAEL?

>> WE ARE AFTER THE BEGINNING OF THE WAR.

THE RESOLUTION WAS MADE.

AND THERE WAS ONLY ONE OPTION.

TO GO FORWARD AND TO ACCOMPLISH THE JOB.

THE JOB HAS TO BE DONE BY ISRAEL.

BY THE UNITED STATES.

BY THE FREE WORLD.

WE DON'T SEE WHY IRAN NEEDS CIVILIAN NUCLEAR ENERGY.

THEY POSSESS 11% OF THE OIL AND GAS RESERVE IN THE WORLD.

WHY DO THEY NEED ANY KIND OF NUCLEAR ENERGY?

THE REASON IS DIFFERENT DIFFERENT.

THEY WANT TO POSSESS NUCLEAR AND TO THREATEN EVERYBODY AROUND THEM INCLUDING ISRAEL.

IT IS EUROPE.

IT IS THE GULF STATES.

THEY WANT TO CREATE SOMETHING DIFFERENT AND THEY WANT TO CONTROL.

THE MIDDLE EAST CONTROL THEIR OWN PEOPLE AS A RIDDLE REGIME.

WE ARE NOT GOING TO ALLOW THAT TO HAPPEN.

>> RICHARD, WHAT DO YOU MAKE OF THAT, THAT OF A FORMER DEFENSE MINISTER SPENDING TIME WITH BIDEN ADMINISTRATION WHEN HE WAS IN OFFICE THEN, SAYING THAT THE UNITED STATES HAS AN OBLIGATION TO CHANGE THE MIDDLE EAST AND INFLUENCE THE WORLD IN ASSISTING ISRAEL AND THE WORLD?

>> I WOULD SAY THE UNITED STATES HAS A BIG DECISION TO MAKE.

ISRAEL'S POLICY AS YOU WERE JUST SAYING, WITH CHRISTIANE, IS THERE OR TWO GOALS.

ONE IS THE GOAL OF A REGIME CHANGE.

I WOULD CALL THAT MORE OF A HOPE AND NOT A STRATEGY.

THERE IS NO WAY ISRAEL CAN SAY, IF WE DO A, B AND C, CHANGE WILL COME ABOUT.

AND WE DON'T KNOW WHAT THE SUCCESS OF THE REGIME OR SITUATION WILL BE LIKE.

LET'S PUT THAT ASIDE.

THE OTHER THING YOU CAN DO IS SAY THE PURPOSE OF THE WAR IS TO SERIOUSLY DEGRADE.

YOU CAN'T ELIMINATE THE NUCLEAR CAPABILITY BUT YOU COULD SERIOUSLY DEGRADE IT.

YOU CAN'T ELIMINATE IT BUT THERE ARE PROBABLY PLACES THAT HAVE NUCLEAR MATERIALS THAT WE DON'T KNOW ABOUT.

YOU OBVIOUSLY CAN'T ELIMINATE THE KNOW-HOW WITHIN PEOPLE'S HEADS.

IRAN COULD ALWAYS RECONSTITUTE CERTAIN THINGS AND PLACES EVEN HARDER TO GET TO.

I THINK THE BIG DECISION FOR THE UNITED STATES RIGHT NOW IS, DOES IT GET ISRAEL THE MUNITIONS OR ANYTHING ELSE THAT NEEDS TO ATTACK WITH THE CONFIDENCE THAT IT COULD DESTROY A LARGE PERCENTAGE OF IT?

THAT IS THE DECISION WE HAVE TO MAKE.

AND IN FAVOR OF THAT, TO BE BLUNT, IS THE IDEA THAT WE DON'T WANT TO MIDDLE EASTERN NORTH KOREA.

THE UNITED STATES HAD OPPORTUNITIES TO ATTACK THE NORTH KOREAN PROGRAM IN ITS INFANCY.

WE DIDN'T.

PARTIALLY BECAUSE WE DIDN'T WANT TO TRIGGER A LARGER WAR ON THE KOREAN PENINSULA.

WE DON'T HAVE THOSE CONSTRAINTS NOW.

I THINK IT IS A REAL ISSUE FOR THE PRESIDENT.

AND HIS PROBLEMS POLITICALLY.

YOU HAVE PEOPLE IN HIS PACE BASED THAT ARE DIVIDED.

YOU HAVE THOSE WHO FEAR IT WOULD LEAD TO EVER GREATER AMERICAN INVOLVEMENT IN THE MIDDLE EAST AND IN A WAR THIS WILL BE ONE OF THE BIG EARLY DECISIONS OF HIS PRESIDENCY.

>> YOU ARE ALLUDING TO SOME OF THE DECISION DIVISIONS AND FRACTURES WE ARE SEEING WITHIN THE MAGA BASE AND NAMES LIKE TUCKER CARLSON WHO THE PRESIDENT TOOK AIM AT THIS WEEKEND SAYING AMERICA FIRST MEANS A NUCLEAR FREE IRAN AND THAT HE ULTIMATELY WILL MAKE THE DECISION, THAT IS PRESIDENT TRUMP.

ONE IDEA I HEARD FLOATED AND I DON'T KNOW HOW MUCH VALIDITY THERE IS TO IT, IS THE OPTION NO MILITARY PERSONNEL FIGHTING AND ASSISTING ISRAEL.

BUT PERHAPS UNITED STATES, PROVIDING ISRAEL WITH THE MILITARY EQUIPMENT, THE B2 BOMBERS AND THE BUMPER BUSTERS, TO GET THE JOB DONE THEMSELVES.

HOW VALID DO YOU THINK THOSE IDEAS ARE BEING FLOATED?

>> THIS IS A WAR ESSENTIALLY WITHOUT BOOTS ON THE GROUND.

YOU ARE NOT SEEING ISRAELI GROUND FORCES INVOLVED BECAUSE OF THE GEOGRAPHY.

THIS IS A WAR AND BOTH COUNTRIES ARE LARGELY FIGHTING FROM THE AIR.

PUT ASIDE THE IRANIAN PROXIES LIKE HAS BLOOD AND HAMAS, WHO HAVE BEEN INVOLVED ON THE SIDES OF THIS.

THE REAL QUESTION IS, WHETHER THE UNITED STATES OFFERS MUNITIONS AND ANYTHING ELSE COULD BE INTELLIGENCE.

I DON'T THINK ISRAEL WOULD NEED AMERICAN B2 BOMBERS.

THE BEST I KNOW, THEY ARE NOT TRAINED TO FLY THEM.

THE REAL QUESTION IS, DOES UNITED STATES WANT THAT TO HAPPEN?

DOES THE UNITED STATES WANT ISRAEL TO SERIOUSLY TAKE OUT THIS COMPLEX?

IF SO, I THINK PART OF THE ANSWER IS, WHAT HAPPENS NEXT?

IS LINKED TO A DIPLOMATIC INITIATIVE?

TO BE GIVEN TO ISRAEL UNDER CERTAIN DIPLOMATIC CONDITIONS AND SO FORTH?

THAT IS THE ADMINISTRATION THINKING.

>> SOMETHING ELSE THAT WAS SAID TO ME WHEN I ASKED ABOUT THE WAR IN GAZA AND WHAT IMPACT AT ALL THAT THIS NEW OPERATION HAS, IN THIS VIEW, --AND ONE OF THE REASONS HE ULTIMATELY WAS FIRED FROM HIS POST AND WHAT SPARKED DIVISION BETWEEN HIM AND PRIME MINISTER NETANYAHU IS BECAUSE HE BECAME CRITICAL OF WHAT HE SAYS WAS A LACK OF STRATEGY.

HE SAID THE SITUATION WAS RIGHT FOR A CEASE-FIRE HOSTAGE DEAL AT THE TIME WHEN EDMUND NETANYAHU OPTED NOT TO GO FOR ONE.

HE SAID THAT IF THIS WHERE AN ACCOMPLISH THEIR GOALS SOONER RATHER THAN LATER, HE THINKS THAT WILL ULTIMATELY LEAD TO A DEAL IN GAZA.

WHAT YOU MAKE OF THAT?

>> IT IS NOT CLEAR TO ME BECAUSE THEY HAVE DIFFERENT DYNAMICS.

IF IRAN IS MORE WEAK AS A RESULT OF THIS, IT COULD BE THEY ARE AND LESS OF A POSITION TO HELP HAMAS.

SEEMS TO BE LARGELY SELF- SUFFICIENT ALBEIT AT A LOWER LEVEL AT THIS POINT.

I THINK THERE ARE OTHER THINGS TO TAKE FROM THIS.

ISRAEL'S BEHAVIOR IN GAZA FROM OCTOBER 8th ON HAS CLEARLY HEARD IT STANDING IN THE UNITED STATES AND OBVIOUSLY WITH EUROPE.

WE ARE SEEING THAT AT THE G7.

AND GAZA IS A GOOD MORNING.

ISRAEL GOT INTO A WAR WITH NAMES I COULD NOT BE REALIZED.

THE TOTAL ELIMINATION OF HAMAS.

NOW, IN THIS WAR WITH IRAN, I BELIEVE THEY HAVE TO BE CAREFUL NOT TO MAKE THE SAME MISTAKE IT CANNOT BE A REGIME CHANGE.

THERE IS NO WAY TO BUILD THE STRATEGY TO BRING THAT ABOUT.

IT MAY HAPPEN AND YOU ARE THE OTHER IS TO ELIMINATE IRAN'S NUCLEAR PROGRAM.

IT SEEMS TO ME ISRAEL NEEDS TO DEFINE ACHIEVABLE WAR AIMS AND MARY A MILITARY STRATEGY TO A DIPLOMATIC STRATEGY.

AND I HAVE NOT SEEN THAT IN THIS CASE YET.

>> WHAT DO YOU MAKE OF THE PRESIDENT'S PHONE CALL WITH VLADIMIR PUTIN.

OBVIOUSLY VLADIMIR PUTIN HAS A STAKE IN THIS AS WELL GIVEN HIS RELATIONSHIP WITH IRAN AS HIS WERE IN UKRAINE HAS SURPASSED THREE YEARS.

VLADIMIR PUTIN SAID HE WOULD LIKE TO HELP IN BRINGING THIS TO AN END AT FINDING A RESOLUTION.

WE KNOW THAT THE COMPLICATED RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN THESE TWO MEN IS THERE AND IT IS VERY RARE THAT WE HEAR PRESIDENT TRUMP CRITICIZED LATTIMORE PUTIN.

DO YOU THINK HE COULD ENTER THE FOLD HERE AND PLAY A LARGER ROLE?

>> HE COULD INTO THE FOLD AND PLAY A LARGER ROLE.

BUT I SEE NO REASON TO BELIEVE IT WOULD BE A CONSTRUCTIVE ROLE FIRST OF ALL, HE LIKES THE IDEA OF DISARRAY.

WHY?

IT RAISES OIL PRICES, WHICH IS GOOD FOR HIS ECONOMY.

THAT IS THE ONE THING RUSSIA CAN REALLY EXPORT RIGHT NOW.

AND IT IS REALLY RICH.

THE WORD THAT COMES TO MIND AND WHAT I'M FAMILIAR WITH IS HUDZA.

FOR THE RUSSIAN GOVERNMENT TO DENOUNCE ISRAEL ON THE BASIS ISRAEL IS ATTACKING A SOVEREIGN COUNTRY?

REALLY?

AFTER THREE AND A HALF YEARS OF THE SECOND PHASE OF ITS WAR AGAINST UKRAINE?

I THINK THE UNITED STATES SHOULD THANK THE RUSSIANS AND BASICALLY SAY, IF YOU ARE SO INTERESTED IN PROMOTING WORLD ORDER, THIS BEGINS CLOSER TO HOME.

IN THIS CASE, WITH UKRAINE.

>> HYPOCRITE OR HOWEVER YOU WANT TO DESCRIBE IT THERE.

I GET YOUR POINT, RICHARD.

THE IDEA OF WHETHER ISRAEL'S ULTIMATE GOAL IS DEGRADING THE NUCLEAR PROGRAM BY YEARS, WHICH IS WHAT YOAV GALLANT SAID.

HE THINK THAT HAS ALREADY BEEN ACCOMPLISHED IN THESE FIRST FOUR DAYS ALTHOUGH I THINK OTHERS HAVE BEEN MORE SKEPTICAL OR WHETHER IT IS ULTIMATELY REGIME CHANGE.

THERE SEEMS TO BE ONE MESSAGE FROM THIS ISRAELI GOVERNMENT WHEN ASKED THAT QUESTION.

HERE IS WHAT THAT PRESIDENT SAID ON THAT.

>> I'M QUITE CONFIDENT WITH WHAT WE HAVE SHOWN SO FAR WILL CONTINUE DRAMATICALLY.

AND IT CAN CHANGE THE COURSE OF HOW THINGS ARE IN IRAN.

AFTER ALL, THE IRANIAN PEOPLE HAVE BEEN OPPRESSED FOR DECADES WE ALL BELIEVE THEY ARE FED UP.

IT IS THEIR CHANCE TO RISE AND CHANGE THE REGIME.

IT IS NOT ONE OF OUR OBJECTIVES.

THE OBJECTIVE IS TO MOVE AND REMOVE THE IRANIAN NUCLEAR PROGRAM WHICH INCLUDES WITH IT A MASSIVE MISSILE PROGRAM.

>> THE SAME WITH YOAV GALLANT TELLING ME, I'M NOT RESISTING.

OF SUPPORTING A CHANGE OF REGIME IN IRAN BUT IT WILL BE DONE BY THE IRANIAN PEOPLE AND NOT BY THE ISRAELIS OR AMERICANS.

YOUR TAKE.

>> THAT IS RIGHT.

IT CANNOT BE DONE BY ISRAEL OR A LONG SHOT GIVEN THE DYNAMICS.

I THINK IT RAISES A LARGER POINT.

WE TALK TO THE LAST TO MINUTES ABOUT DECISIONS UNITED STATES IS TO MAKE ABOUT WHETHER TO SUPPLY ISRAEL WITH A CERTAIN ORDINANCE.

AND THINGS ISRAEL HAS TO DO WITH ITS WAR AIMS.

IRAN HAS TO MAKE BIG DECISIONS TOO AND YOU ALLUDED TO SOME WITH CHRISTIANE.

FOR EXAMPLE, ACCEPTING DIPLOMATIC OUTCOMES ON THE BASIS THAT THEY NEED TO DO SO TO SAVE THE REGIME AND PRESERVE THE REVOLUTION.

AND ONE ANALOGY IS THE LATE 80S WITH IRAQ.

ANOTHER OPTION FOR IRAN IS TO WIDEN THE WORK.

I IMAGINE SOME IN TEHRAN WILL SAY, WE NEED TO MAKE THE AMERICANS, EUROPEANS AND OTHERS PAY A LARGER PRICE FOR THE SITUATION.

THE WAY TO DO THAT IS TO RAISE PRICE OF OIL AND TO ATTACK SAUDI OIL INSTALLATIONS.

I THINK THAT IS AN OPTION FOR IRAN.

THE OTHER POSSIBILITY BY THE WAY IS TO JUST LET THIS DRAG ON.

PEOPLE CANNOT EXPECT THE DRAMATIC END TO THINGS SOON.

ANOTHER POSSIBILITY.

LIKE THE WERE IN UKRAINE AND IN GAZA.

IT IS FOR THE WAR TO SIMPLY BE OPEN-ENDED.

>> RICHARD, GOOD TO SEE YOU.

WE APPRECIATE YOUR TIME.

>> LATER IN THE PROGRAM, THE WRITER CAPTURING THE PHYSICAL AND EMOTIONAL CARNAGE IN GAZA.

WE HAVE MORE ON THE PULITZER PRIZE-WINNING AUTHOR AND POET.

>> I HAVE NOT WRITTEN FOR NEARLY FIVE MONTHS.

WHAT IS THE POINT OF WRITING ABOUT THIS ATROCITY?

IT IS GOING TO HAPPEN AGAIN AND AGAIN.

AND THEN FUNDING THIS ATROCITY?

WHAT IS THE POINT OF WRITING THIS?

>> AFTER NATIONWIDE MANHUNT, THE SUSPECT IN THE SHOOTINGS OF TWO IN AS LITTLE LAWMAKERS AND THEIR SPOUSES HAS BEEN ARRESTED.

DEMOCRATIC STATE REPRESENTATIVE ALICIA MENENDEZ AND HER HUSBAND TIM WALZ CALLED A POLITICALLY MOTIVATED ASSASSINATION.

STATE SENATOR JOHN HOFFMAN AND HIS WIFE WERE WOUNDED.

>> ONE MAN'S UNTHINKABLE ACTIONS HAVE HAD A HAND IN THIS.

THE BUILDING WE STAND IN, ALICIA MENENDEZ HELPED RUN -- USHER THROUGH SO WE COULD RESPOND WITH THE PROFESSIONALISM AND GIVING THE TOOLS NECESSARY FOR ONE PERSON TO DO THEIR JOB.

FOR MELISSA AND MARK'S FAMILY, WE CANNOT FATHOM THE PAIN AND GRIEF YOU ARE GOING THROUGH.

WE TAKE SOLACE IN THE MEMORY AND THE WORK THAT MELISSA DID.

AND YOU CAN REST ASSURED THAT WE WILL PUT EVERY OUNCE OF EFFORT THAT THE STATE OF MINNESOTA HAS TO MAKE SURE JUSTICE IS SERVED AND THE INDIVIDUAL RESPONSIBLE FOR THIS SERVES THE TIME FOR THE UNSPEAKABLE ACT.

>> JOIN ME TO DISCUSS THE SIGNIFICANCE OF THIS IS A STAFF THE NEW YORKER, SUSAN GLASSER FROM NANTUCKET, MASSACHUSETTS.

IT IS GOOD TO SEE YOU.

WE JUST GOT A POLICE AND FBI BRIEFING ON THE SUBJECT SUBJECT.

NO MOTIVE HAS BEEN DETERMINED.

CHARGES HAVE ALREADY BEEN FILED AGAINST HIM.

AND THEY ARE QUITE CHILLING.

THE DETAILS THAT WE KNOW NOW OF VANCE LUTHER BOELTER.

SHOOTING THE MINNESOTA LAWMAKER DEAD AND HER HUSBAND.

THEY FOUND A 9-MILLIMETER ON HIM, BODY ARMOR, MASKS AND NOTEBOOKS CONTAINING NAMES OF 45 STATE REPRESENTATIVES.

SO QUITE A LENGTHY HIT LIST THAT WE FOUND ON HIM AS WELL.

WHAT YOU MAKE OF THIS?

ESPECIALLY GIVEN THE HEIGHTENED POLITICAL TENSIONS IN THIS COUNTRY?

>> THAT IS RIGHT.

THIS IS SOMETHING THAT I THINK LAWMAKERS IN BOTH PARTIES ACROSS THE COUNTRY AND ALL LEVELS OF GOVERNMENT ARE REALIZING THAT THEY MIGHT BE I THINK MEMBERS OF CONGRESS ARE ALREADY EXPRESSING ALARM AND WITH PRIVATE PHONE CALLS THIS WEEKEND AMONG THE CONFERENCES.

IT WILL BE INTERESTING TO SEE WHEN THEY COME BACK TO WASHINGTON, TO WHAT EXTENT THIS BECOMES AN ISSUE.

STATE LEGISLATORS REALIZING IT IS NOT JUST AT THE FEDERAL LEVEL THAT THIS KIND OF POLITICIZED RHETORIC MIGHT ACTUALLY HAVE TERRIBLE CONSEQUENCES FOR INDIVIDUALS.

I REALLY FEEL LIKE IT IS ONE OF THOSE MOMENTS THAT YOU HOPE PEOPLE SIT UP AT ATTENTION AND SAY, THINGS HAVE GONE TOO FAR IN THIS COUNTRY.

AND THE DEMONIZATION THAT EXISTS IS SOMETHING THAT IS REALLY SHOCKING FOR POLITICIANS IN MINNESOTA AND ACROSS THE COUNTRY TODAY.

>> WE HEARD CONDEMNATION FROM THE WHITE HOUSE AND ADMINISTRATION OFFICIALS AS WELL, TO THIS.

POLITICAL ASSASSINATIONS SADLY ARE A TOPIC WE HAVE BEEN COVERING AT GREAT LENGTH OVER THE PAST YEAR AND A HALF.

THE PRESIDENT HIMSELF BEING SUBJECT TO TWO OF THEM.

AND CLEARLY, THIS IS AN ISSUE AFFECTING BOTH REPUBLICANS AND DEMOCRATS.

WHAT ARE YOU HEARING FROM MEMBERS OF CONGRESS IN TERMS OF THEIR VULNERABILITY, FEAR OF SAFETY?

DO WE NEED TO HAVE MORE SECURITY IN PLACE NOW AND A REASSESSMENT OF HOW SOME OF OUR LAWMAKERS ARE PROTECTED?

>> I DO THINK THERE IS AN ENORMOUS FEAR OF MEMBERS OF CONGRESS THAT HAS JUSTIFICATION.

INCREASINGLY, WE HAVE ALREADY SEEN MORE SECURITY FOR MORE HIGH-PROFILE MEMBERS OF CONGRESS.

NOT JUST MEMBERS OF THE LEADERSHIP BUT MORE INDIVIDUAL MEMBERS OF CONGRESS HAVE NEEDED SECURITY IN RECENT YEARS.

ESPECIALLY IN THE TRUMP ERA.

I THINK ONE OF THE QUESTIONS I HAVE IS THE U.S. CAPITAL HAS BEEN LARGELY ONE OF THE MORE OPEN AND ACCESSIBLE PARTS OF WASHINGTON.

TO JOURNALISTS AND MEMBERS OF THE PUBLIC.

AND I WONDER WHETHER THE LONGER- THE ELECTED REPRESENTATIVES MORE OFTEN FROM THE PEOPLE.

NOT ONLY IN WASHINGTON BUT POSSIBLY IN STATE CAPITALS AROUND THE COUNTRY AS WELL.

>> SENATOR AMY KLOBUCHAR TOLD THE NEW YORK TIMES THAT PEOPLE HAD JUST GOTTEN MORE AND MORE ANGRY AND HAVE STARTED TO ACT OUT WHAT THEY READ ONLINE WORK AT SOME POINT, YOU HAVE TO LOOK IN THE MIRROR.

WHEN YOU LOOK AT WHAT IS GOING ON HERE, EVERY SINGLE ELECTED OFFICIAL DOES.

AND THAT RAISES A QUESTION THAT WE HAVE HEARD MANY MEMBERS OF CONGRESS, ELECTED OFFICIALS AND THOSE CONTEMPLATING GOING INTO POLITICS, ASKING THEMSELVES.

IS IT WORTH IT?

WHY SHOULD I RISK NOT ONLY MY LIFE BUT THE LIVES OF MY FAMILY MEMBERS AS WELL?

ARE YOU HEARING SIMILAR CONCERNS?

>> ABSOLUTELY.

FIRST OF ALL, THERE IS THIS TERRIBLE THREAT OF PHYSICAL VIOLENCE AGAINST ELECTED OFFICIALS ALSO, THE DEMONIZATION OF ELECTED OFFICIALS AND PUBLIC FIGURES OF ANY TYPE INCLUDING JOURNALISTS BY THE WAY AND THEIR FAMILY MEMBERS.

THIS IS A VERY HATEFUL ERA OF PUBLIC SPEECH.

AND TO STOP SHORT OF PHYSICAL VIOLENCE.

IT HAS BECOME A VERY POLLUTED PUBLIC SPACE.

I WOULD REMIND PEOPLE THAT THIS IS NOT UNIQUE TO THE TRUMP ERA UNFORTUNATELY.

REMEMBER STEVE SCALISE, WHO WAS A REPUBLICAN ELECTED MEMBER OF LEADERSHIP ON CAPITOL HILL, WHO WAS SHOT DURING PRACTICE FOR THE CONGRESSIONAL BASEBALL GAME QUITE A NUMBER OF YEARS AGO AND LUCKILY SURVIVED THAT.

IT IS A REMINDER OF THE VULNERABILITY OF PEOPLE WHO HAVE MADE THEIR LIVES IN THE PUBLIC SPHERE.

AND I JUST SEE THAT THREAT AS COLLATING AND ESCALATING UNFORTUNATELY.

>> SPEAKING OF A UNIQUE PHENOMENON, LET'S TALK ABOUT WHAT WE SAW OVER THE WEEKEND.

THAT WAS THE MILITARY PARADE IN WASHINGTON D.C.

IT WAS SET TO CELEBRATE THE 250TH BIRTHDAY OF THE U.S. ARMY COINCIDING OF COURSE WITH THE PRESIDENT'S BIRTHDAY.

IT IS THAT SAME UNFAMILIAR THING TO MOST AMERICANS AND MANY TOP MILITARY OFFICIALS, BOTH RETIRED AND CURRENTLY SERVING, AS WE KNOW AND HAS --AS YOU HAVE INTERVIEWED AND SPOKEN TO, MADE THEM QUITE UNCOMFORTABLE.

IT IS NOT SOMETHING WE SEE IN THE UNITED STATES AND PERHAPS THAT IS FOR A REASON.

WHAT DID YOU MAKE OF WHAT HAPPENED OVER THE WEEKEND?

>> IT REALLY WAS ALMOST A VISUAL REPRESENTATION OF THE SPLIT SCREEN REALITY AND THE UNITED STATES RIGHT NOW WITH JUST EXTREME LEVELS OF POLITICAL POLARIZATION.

YOU HAD DONALD TRUMP ON HIS BIRTHDAY WITH THIS ENORMOUS MULTIMILLION DOLLAR PARADE IN WASHINGTON D.C. AT THE SAME TIME, THERE WERE THOUSANDS OF "NO KINGS" PROTESTS AROUND THE COUNTRY AND IN THE UNITED STATES.

AND AN ESTIMATED 4-5 MILLION AMERICANS PARTICIPATED IN IT REALLY UNDERSCORED COMPETING VISIONS OF THE COUNTRY AT THE SAME TIME.

I WAS STRUCK, AS I'M SURE YOU WERE, BY THE SOMEWHAT LOWER- THAN-EXPECTED TURNOUT IN WASHINGTON FOR TRUMP'S PARADE.

THEY TALKED ABOUT 200,000 PEOPLE.

A VERY LARGE CROWD FOR WASHINGTON D.C., THAT CLEARLY DID NOT FULLY MATERIALIZE.

SOMETHING THAT I'M SURE IS A SORE SPOT FOR DONALD TRUMP GIVEN HIS VIEWS ABOUT THE IMPORTANCE OF CROWD SIZES, AND AN INDICATOR OF THE POPULARITY THAT HE HIMSELF HAS.

MORE IMPORTANTLY, I THINK IS THIS NOTION THAT TRUMP HAS THAT HE WANTS TO CREATE MILITARIZED SPECTACLES TO CLOAK HIMSELF IN THE PUBLIC OPTICS OF THE POWER AND STRENGTH OF THE U.S. MILITARY.

THAT IS SOMETHING HE HAS BEEN ATTRACTED TO SINCE THE BEGINNING OF HIS FIRST PRESIDENCY.

IT IS SOMETHING THE NONPARTISAN LEADERSHIP OF THE U.S. MILITARY HAS REALLY FRANKLY BEEN QUITE ALLERGIC TO.

I WILL NEVER FORGET THAT MEMORABLE COMMENT FROM JAMES MATTIS, THE FORMER MARINE GENERAL WHO WAS TRUMP'S FIRST DEFENSE SECRETARY.

HE WAS QUOTED IN THE FIRST TERM SAYING THAT HE WOULD RATHER SWALLOW ACID THEN PUT ON A MILITARY PARADE LIKE THAT FOR DONALD TRUMP.

WELL, EXCEPT AS A VERY DIFFERENT KIND OF DEFENSE SECRETARY.

AND HE SEEMED MORE THAN HAPPY TO PARTICIPATE IN THE PARADE THIS WEEKEND.

MY CONCERN IS NOT SO MUCH IN A SPECTACLE THAT IS OVER AND PROBABLY QUICKLY FORGOTTEN, BUT TRUMP'S VISION OF A WORLD IN WHICH HE CAN ROUTINELY DEPLOY THE U.S. MILITARY TO QUELL DOMESTIC POLITICAL DISTURBANCES AS HE IS TRYING TO DO RIGHT NOW IN LOS ANGELES.

AND HE SAID HE WOULD BE WILLING TO DO ANYWHERE ELSE AROUND THE COUNTRY IF HE DETERMINES THAT IT IS NECESSARY.

THAT IS A DIFFERENT VISION OF THE USE OF THE MILITARY AND WE HISTORICALLY HAVE HAD THAT.

I KNOW WILL BE AS OBJECTIVE COURT CHALLENGE RIGHT NOW IN THE FEDERAL COURT.

WORRISOME INDICATOR.

>> YOU AND I WERE TALKING ABOUT THIS OVER THE WEEKEND.

THE SORT OF SPLIT SCREEN THAT IT CREATES AND THE DICHOTOMY OF, ON THE ONE HAND, YOU HAVE A PRESIDENT WHO WAS WILLING TO SEND THOUSANDS OF NATIONAL GUARDS AND MARINES WHEN THE GOVERNOR OF THE STATE AND IN THIS CASE, CALIFORNIA, INTO THE STREETS OF LOS ANGELES, THE SECOND LARGEST CITY IN THE COUNTRY AND THEY ARE SAYING, WE DON'T NEED THIS ASSISTANCE.

WE DON'T NEED THE SHOW OF FORCE.

AT THE SAME TIME, YOU HAVE A PRESIDENT THAT RAN ON, AMERICA FIRST AND NOT STARTING WARS AND BEING HESITANT AND RETICENT AND HIS CRITICS PERHAPS -- THINKING CORRECTLY THAT THE UNITED STATES SHOULD NOT BE INTERFERING MILITARILY AROUND THE WORLD.

WHAT DOES THAT SAY ABOUT HIS FOCUS AND HIS VIEWS ON THE MILITARY?

>> I'M SO GLAD YOU BROUGHT THIS SET.

I THINK THIS IS REALLY IMPORTANT TO UNDERSCORE.

DONALD TRUMP IS REDEFINING, IN NATIONAL SECURITY, TO MEAN DOMESTIC ENEMIES.

WHAT HE CALLS THE ENEMY FROM WITHIN AS BEING THE BIGGER THREAT TO HIM THEN EVEN THE INTERNATIONAL ADVERSARIES SUCH AS RUSSIA AND CHINA.

AND RIGHT NOW, YOU HAVE THIS BIZARRE JUXTAPOSITION WHERE TRUMP HAS MORE WILLINGNESS TO DEPLOY THE U.S. MARINES TO LOS ANGELES, THEN TO CONFLICT IN THE MIDDLE EAST.

AND IT ALSO REFLECTS A REAL DISAGREEMENT AMONG HIS CORE REPUBLICAN SUPPORTERS.

YOU HAVE AMERICA FIRST TYPES LIKE TUCKER CARLSON OPENLY COMING OUT AND SAYING, EITHER IT IS TIME FOR TRUMP TO CUT LOOSE ISRAEL, OR WE WILL BE SUCKED INTO A WAR OF ISRAEL'S CHOOSING.

AT THE SAME TIME, MORE TRADITIONAL REPUBLICANS ARE URGING TRUMP TO GET INVOLVED DIRECTLY ON ISRAEL'S SIDE AND PARTICIPATE IN STRIKES TO MAKE SURE THAT CAPABILITIES ARE TAKEN OUT IN THE COURSE OF THIS NEW CONFLICT THAT HAS JUST BEGUN OVER THE LAST FEW DAYS.

SO YOU HAVE A RUPTURE INSIDE OF THE REPUBLICAN PARTY ITSELF.

AND I THINK TRUMP IS KIND OF ZIGZAGGING AND UNCERTAIN PUBLIC MESSAGING SINCE THE ISRAELI STRIKE CENTER BEGAN A FEW WEEKS AGO AND HE HIMSELF HAS NOT QUITE MADE UP HIS MIND WHICH PART OF THIS HE WILL ENDORSE IN THE CONFLICT.

>> YOU HAD SORT OF AN ECONOMIC RUPTURE WITHIN THE REPUBLICAN PARTY THIS YEAR EARLIER AS IT RELATES TO NOT ONLY THE PRESIDENT'S BUDGET BILL BUT ALSO TARIFFS.

NOW IT SEEMS WE ARE SEEING SOMETHING SIMILAR WHEN IT COMES TO THE USE OF MILITARY FORCE IN FOREIGN POLICY.

WE WILL CONTINUE TO FOLLOW THIS STORY.

ALL OF IT.

SUSAN GLASSER, THANK YOU AS ALWAYS FOR JOINING US.

>> THANK YOU.

>> PEOPLE IN GAZA COULD SEE TENSION BETWEEN ISRAEL AND IRAN ESCALATING OVER THE WEEKEND.

WITH THESE IRANIAN MISSILES, SEEN FROM THE ENCLAVE.

AS THE WORLD TURNS ITS ATTENTION TO THE NEW CONFLICT, ONE ISRAELI COLUMNIST HAS WARNED THAT IT IS NOT GOOD NEWS FOR GAZA.

GIDEON LEVY SAYS THAT GAZA WILL BE UNDER A SHADE AND SAID SO MANY CIVILIANS DON'T EVEN HAVE A SLICE OF BREAD TO FEED THEMSELVES AND THEIR FAMILIES AFTER ISRAEL IMPOSED A FULL HUMANITARIAN BLOCKADE ON FOOD, METAL COAL SUPPLIES AND OTHER AID FOR 11 WEEKS.

THE UNITED NATIONS WARNS THAT WITH THE HUNGER CRISIS WORSENING, A CEASE-FIRE IS THE ONLY WAY TO SAFELY REACH PEOPLE WITH LIFESAVING ASSISTANCE.

SOME OF THE MOST POWERFUL THE FICTIONS OF LIFE UNDER THIS BOMBARDMENT COMES FROM OTHERS LIKE OUR NEXT GUEST.

LAST MONTH HE WON THE PILLOWED SURPRISE FOR COMMENTARY FOR HIS SERIES OF NEW YORKER ESSAYS DOCUMENTING THE SUFFERING OF PEOPLE IN GAZA.

SINCE OCTOBER 7th AND THE WAR IN GAZA BEGAN, HE HAS LOST COUNTLESS FAMILY MEMBERS AND THE VIOLENCE.

HE JOINED CHRISTIANE IN NEW ATTACKED IRAN LAST WEEK.

>> WELCOME BACK TO THE PROGRAM.

FIRST, CONGRATULATIONS.

I WONDER IF YOU FEEL A SENSE OF SATISFACTION OR DOING YOUR JOB TO RAISE THE PLIGHT OF YOUR FAMILY AND FRIENDS AND OTHERS IN GAZA BECAUSE IT IS SO DIFFICULT TO GET WORD OUT.

>> THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR HAVING ME, CHRISTIANE.

I THINK THAT FOR ANY JOURNALIST TO WIN A PULITZER PRIZE IS THE SATISFACTION.

BUT THIS SATISFACTION IS LACKING BECAUSE THE STORIES THAT I WROTE ABOUT IN THE LAST YEAR AND A HALF HAVE BEEN HAPPENING AND HAPPENING AGAIN EVERY DAY.

THE SAME STORIES THAT I HAD WRITTEN ABOUT.

THE DESTRUCTION OF GAZA AND THE BLOWING UP OF HOUSES.

FORCING PEOPLE TO LEAVE THEM.

IT CONTINUES ON TO TODAY.

THIS DESTRUCTION CONTINUES.

IT CONTINUES TO TODAY BUT IN DIFFERENT WAYS.

THIS TIME, THE STARVATION TOOK A DIFFERENT TURN IN WHICH THE FOUNDATION HAS LURED PEOPLE INTO GOING TO THEIR SITES WHERE THE ISRAELI SOLDIERS ARE NOT FAR FROM THEM, TO SHOOT THEM.

TO KILL THEM.

I TALKED TO SO MANY PEOPLE.

PEOPLE I KNOW OR PEOPLE WHO ARE MY NEIGHBORS OR WHO ARE MY STUDENTS WHO WENT TO THAT SITE AND THEY WERE KILLED ON THE SPOT WITH BULLETS.

WHILE THEY WERE GATHERING THERE BEFORE, DURING OR AFTER THEY COLLECTED A SMALL AMOUNT OF AID.

>> MOSAB ABU TOHA, ARE YOU ACCUSING ISRAEL OF DIRECTLY KILLING PEOPLE?

OBVIOUSLY THEY WOULD DENY THAT.

WHY DO YOU SAY THAT?

I MEAN, DELIBERATELY.

>> IT IS NOT ACCUSING ISRAEL.

IT IS THE PEOPLE THERE.

THE ISRAELI SOLDIERS WERE THE FOOD SITES ARE.

IT IS NOT ME ACCUSING.

KILLING OF 15 MEDICS IN RAFAH.

IT WAS A VIDEO THERE.

AND OF COURSE THERE WAS NO CONSEQUENCES FOR THESE ACTIONS.

SO ISRAEL IS ACCUSED OF DOING EVERY KILLING IN GAZA.

ISRAEL, AS YOU KNOW, CONTROLS THE AREA AND THE LAND.

SO EVERY PALESTINIAN KILLED IN GAZA, THEY ARE KILLED BY ISRAEL.

UNLESS THERE IS ANY PROOF THAT THEY WERE KILLED BY SOMEONE ELSE FROM THAT SPACE.

>> AS YOU KNOW, THE GAZA HUMANITARIAN FOUNDATION IS ACCUSING HAMAS OF ATTACKING ONE OF ITS BUSES.

THAT WAS JUST RECENTLY.

WITH AID WORKERS AND IT.

I WANT TO SAY, TO BE CLEAR THAT ON JUNE 1st, THERE WAS A SHOOTING NEAR THE A DISTRIBUTION SITE.

31 PALESTINIANS WERE KILLED.

THE CNN INVESTIGATION WAS PUBLISHED JUNE 6th AND THE FINDINGS DEW POINT TO THE ISRAELI MILITARY OPENING FIRE ON CROWDS OF PALESTINIANS AS THEY TRIED TO GET FOOD.

THEY DECLINED TO ANSWER QUESTIONS ABOUT THE CNN FINDINGS.

THAT IS JUST TO SAY THAT CNN HAS DONE AN INVESTIGATION AND WE ARE STILL WAITING FOR ANSWERS.

LET ME ASK YOU THIS.

THE STORIES YOU TELL OF THE HUMANITARIAN NEED AND SUFFERING ARE SO VISCERAL THAT IT IS REALLY HARD TO READ.

FOR INSTANCE, YOUR LATEST PIECE YOU REFERRED TO, YOU TALK ABOUT FAMILY MEMBERS WHO ARE FORCED TO EAT RANCID FLOUR.

YOU SAY --TEL L ME WHAT THAT IS LIKE, WHEN YOU ARE STILL WITH YOUR EATING THIS?

WHY ARE THEY EATING ROTTEN FLOUR?

>> THIS IS VERY HARD TO LISTEN TO THE STORY AGAIN AFTER I HEARD IT FROM MY SISTER AND MY MOTHER-IN-LAW WHO ARE EATING FOOD THAT CANNOT BE EATEN BY BEFORE I ANSWER THIS, OF COURSE, AS A PALESTINIAN, I'M NOT GOING TO WAIT FOR CNN TO RUN INVESTIGATIONS OR TO CALL IT A GENOCIDE.

WE ARE SEEING THIS ON THE GROUND.

WITH ALL DUE RESPECT TO THE JOURNALISTIC WORK EVERYONE IS DOING IN THE WORLD.

WE AS PALESTINIANS, WE ARE NOT WAITING FOR ANYONE TO CONFIRM WHAT WE ARE SEEING.

THESE PEOPLE I TALKED TO AND WHO POSTED VIDEOS OF THEIR OWN PLIGHT, THEY DON'T NEED ANYONE FROM THE OUTSIDE WORLD TO CONFIRM WHAT THEY HAVE BEEN TALKING ABOUT.

SO LET'S JUST BE DONE WITH THIS.

THE STORIES THAT I TALKED ABOUT IN GAZA, THESE ARE STORIES OF PEOPLE THAT I KNOW PERSONALLY.

PEOPLE I HAVE INVITED TO HAVE FOOD IN MY HOUSE.

THESE PEOPLE ARE NOW EATING FOOD THAT CANNOT BE EATEN BY ANIMALS.

MY SISTER WHO I TALKED TO A FEW DAYS AGO, SHE TOLD ME THAT SHE WAS PREPARING THE FLOUR TO BE BAKED AND WAS WEARING A MASK BECAUSE OF THE SMELL.

AND EATING THIS FOOD IS MORE KILLING THAN THIS.

AND THE PALESTINIAN PEOPLE, WHEN THEY TRY TO SURVIVE, EVERY FATHER AND MOTHER ARE RESPONSIBLE FOR THEIR CHILDREN.

SO WHEN THEY GO AND TRY TO GET FOOD THAT IS PROMISED TO THEM, THEY ARE KILLED THERE.

YESTERDAY, I POSTED A POST FROM THE HUMANITARIAN GAZA FOUNDATION.

THEY POSTED ON A 7:00 A.M. AT THE MORNING.

IT WAS 3:00 A.M. NEW YORK TIME.

THEY SAID THAT NO ONE SHOULD GO TO THE SITE NEAR THE CORRIDOR BECAUSE THREE HOURS AGO, WE WERE DONE WITH THE DISTRIBUTION.

AND SO THEY DISTRIBUTED THE FOOD.

THEY CALL IT DISTRIBUTION WHICH IS RIDICULOUS.

BECAUSE YOU DO NOT DISTRIBUTE YOU PUT THE PACKAGES IN THE MIDDLE OF A SITE WHERE THERE ARE ISRAELI SOLDIERS.

YOU KNOW, BIG CROWDS, THEY STORM THAT SITE AND COLLECT.

SOME PEOPLE CANNOT GO TO THAT SITE BECAUSE IT IS NOT HUMAN A TERRIEN.

WE MUST STOP CALLING THIS HUMANITARIAN.

THE HUMANITARIAN WORK IS CLEAR.

GIVING FOOD TO THE PEOPLE WHO NEED IT.

>> AND THE U.N. WHO HAS A LONG HISTORY OF DISTRIBUTING IT HAS MADE A LOT OF COMPLAINTS ABOUT IT.

AS WELL AS THE ISRAELIS AROUND THE PERIMETER AND AMERICAN CONTRACTORS.

WE KNOW THIS IS NOT WORKING AND WE KNOW IT HAS DEADLY CONSEQUENCES.

I WANT TO ASK YOU WHAT YOUR FAMILY AND FRIENDS TOLD YOU.

I WAS SHOCKED TO READ --ONE OF YOUR FAMILY MEMBERS SAID, BASICALLY, YOU HAD SEEN -- I COULD SEE SOME PLATES AND A BOWL NEARBY.

THEY HAVE NOTHING IN THEM.

WE LET OURSELVES IMAGINE THAT THERE IS SALAD AND CHICKEN AND PICKLES AS WE CHEWED THE RICE.

AND ANOTHER ONE, YOU SAY YOUR WIFE'S MOTHER, YOUR MOTHER-IN- LAW, IN ORDER TO COOK, THEY ARE DRILLING OUTSIDE TO GET THE ASPHALT BECAUSE WE RAN OUT OF WOOD AND PAPER.

THE ASPHALT CONTAINS PETROLEUM.

THESE ARE VISCERAL AND REALLY TELLING ANECDOTES ABOUT THE DESPERATION AND THE LACK.

WHAT ELSE IS YOUR FAMILY SAYING TO YOU?

>> CHRISTIANE, THERE ARE ADULTS IN GAZA AND THERE ARE CHILDREN WHO ARE 50% OF THE POPULATION.

WHAT THEY ARE TELLING ME IS THAT SOME KIDS ARE 1-YEAR-OLD AND SIMMER FIVE YEARS OLD.

THEY ARE DENYING THEMSELVES TO TO KEEP FOR THE KIDS.

I HAVE A COUSIN OF MY WIFE.

IS SOMERO.

SHE IS SIX YEARS OLD.

SHE WAS CRYING.

MY MOTHER-IN-LAW WHO LIVES WITH THEM SAYS, PLEASE JUST BE PATIENT.

BE PATIENT.

WE WILL EAT AFTER SUNSET.

THEY ARE FORCING THESE KIDS TOO 15, OR 16 HOURS.

AND THE WATER IS NOT EASY TO GET.

THEY ARE FORCING KIDS TOO FOR ABOUT 15 HOURS.

HAVE ANOTHER FRIEND OF MINE LIVING IN A TENT THENCE OCTOBER OF 2023.

HE HAS A DAUGHTER EIGHT MONTHS OLD.

SHE DOES NOT HAVE DIAPERS WHICH IS SOMETHING WE DON'T TALK A LOT ABOUT.

HE PUT RAGS OF COSTS, INSTEAD OF THE DIAPERS BECAUSE THEY CANNOT GET DIAPERS.

THESE PEOPLE ARE STARVING AND THERE IS NO MEDICINE.

THERE IS NO MEDICINE.

THERE WAS A NEIGHBOR OF MINE --AND THIS STORY IS NOT PART OF THE PIECE BECAUSE THERE ARE A LOT OF STORIES.

HE A WEEK BEFORE THE CEASE-FIRE IN JANUARY.

SHE HAS MEDDLE RODS INSIDE AND OUTSIDE OF HER LEGS.

THERE ARE NO PAINKILLERS.

THERE ARE NO ANTIBIOTICS.

AND HE TELLS ME THERE IS NOTHING --NO HEALTHY FOODS FOR HER BODY TO HEAL.

THIS IS A LITTLE BIT OF ANGUISH THAT NO ONE CAN IMAGINE IN THIS WORLD.

THIS HAS BEEN GOING ON FOR 20 MONTHS.

>> BEFORE YOU TELL ME ANOTHER STORY, I WANT TO KNOW ABOUT YOUR OWN FAMILY.

YOU TOLD ME YOU HAD LOST ONE HOCK --APPROXIMATELY 100 MEMBERS OF YOUR EXTENDED FAMILY.

WHAT IS THE NUMBER NOW?

>> CHRISTIANE, I HAVE TO TELL YOU THAT I HATE TO COUNT HOW MANY MEMBERS OF MY FAMILY ARE ALIVE OR HOW MANY WERE KILLED.

THAT WAS OCTOBER OF 2024 WHEN I TO DO THIS.

I TRIED TO COUNT HOW MANY MEMBERS OF MY FAMILY ARE STILL ALIVE.

MY UNCLES AND AUNTS AND COUSINS AND NIECES AND NEPHEWS.

MY WIFE SAID, STOP DOING THAT.

AND THEN I FIGURED OUT A FEW DAYS AFTER THAT THAT MY GREAT AUNT'S HOUSE WAS SEEDS --WAS SEIZED BY THE CAMPS AND 15 PEOPLE WERE KILLED.

I DON'T WANT TO COUNT HOW MANY PEOPLE.

I CAN TELL YOU THAT IN OCTOBER OF 2023 AND THROUGH OCTOBER 2024, I LOST MORE THAN 50 MEMBERS OF MY FAMILY RELATIVES.

FIRST COUSINS.

MY GREAT AUNT AND MY NEPHEWS AND NIECES.

I LOST ALL THESE PEOPLE.

MY WIFE, ALSO THAT SAME MONTH HAD FAMILY KILLED IN THEIR HOUSE.

ONE DAUGHTER WAS KILLED WITH HER HUSBAND AND THREE CHILDREN.

AND CHRISTIANE, UNTIL TODAY, THEY COULDN'T FIND THE REMAINS OF THE FAMILIES KILLED AND THAT AIRSTRIKE OF OCTOBER 2024 UNTIL TODAY.

>> I UNDERSTAND THE AUTHORITIES BELIEVE THERE ARE A HUGE NUMBER OF BODIES UNDER THE RUBBLE, AND EVEN JOURNALISTS WHO WERE JUST AS COURTED IN VERY SMALL GROUPS, THEY SAY IT SMELLS, THE STENCH OF DEATH IS FREQUENT AND RISING IN AREAS THAT THEY GO TO.

CAN I ASK YOU, BECAUSE YOU LEFT.

YOU LEFT AFTER COUPLE OF MONTHS OF THE WAR AND YOU ARE IN THE UNITED STATES.

FIRST OF ALL, WHAT IS IT LIKE BEING OUTSIDE.

MORE TO THE POINT AS WELL.

MANY PALESTINIANS ARE REFUSING TO MOVE BECAUSE THEY ARE AFRAID THEY DON'T WANT TO LEAVE GAZA BECAUSE THEY THINK THEY WILL NEVER BE ALLOWED BACK.

WHAT ARE YOU HEARING FROM YOUR FAMILY AND FRIENDS ON THAT ISSUE?

>> FIRST OF ALL, CHRISTIANE, BEING HERE IN THE UNITED STATES, THE COUNTRY FUNDING THIS GENOCIDE AND VETOING RESOLUTIONS, IT IS VERY DIFFICULT FOR ME TO BE HERE IN THIS COUNTRY.

ANOTHER POINT IS THAT WHEN I TALK TO PEOPLE, MY FRIENDS, ON THE PHONE, THEY EXPECT I CAN HELP THEM FROM HERE.

THEY TELL ME THIS.

I WAS TALKING TO THEM ON THE PHONE TO FACT CHECK SOME INFORMATION SHARED WITH ME.

BEFORE I ENDED THE CALL, THEY SAID, --AND THIS WAS ONE OF THE PEOPLE SHOT IN THE FOOT AND IN THE HOSPITAL.

I TALKED TO HIM THREE DAYS AGO BEFORE THE PIECE WAS PUBLISHED.

HE TOLD ME, MY FIVE KIDS, TWO OF THEM WERE BORN AFTER OCTOBER 7th.

HE SAID MY FIVE KIDS ARE IN THE TENT AND DON'T HAVE ANY FOOD.

HIS KIDS AND WIFE ARE IN GAZA.

HE TOLD ME, MY KIDS DO NOT HAVE FOOD.

AND HE PAUSED, EXPECTING ME TO TELL HIM, I'M GOING TO SEND A SHIP, A BOAT, TO FEED YOUR FAMILY.

I COULDN'T SAY ANYTHING.

PEOPLE THINK THAT BECAUSE WE ARE HERE, IN THE UNITED STATES OR IN EUROPE, WE WERE ABLE TO HELP THEM.

THIS IS HEARTBREAKING FOR ME.

NOT ONLY TO LISTEN TO THEIR STORIES.

THEY TELL ME THE STORIES, HOPING THAT I CAN HELP THEM.

I WISH I COULD HELP THEM.

THIS WORLD SHOULD HELP THESE PEOPLE.

>> YOU OBVIOUSLY KNOW YOUR FELLOW WRITER WHO WROTE A BOOK AND THE TITLE IS EXTREMELY PROVOCATIVE.

ESSENTIALLY, ONE DAY WILL ALWAYS HAVE BEEN AGAINST THIS, IS WHAT HE SAYS.

I THINK IT IS POIGNANT.

YOU POSTED ON X THIS WEEK, "I'M NOT WRITING NEW POEMS THESE DAYS.

I'M SIMPLY RELIVING THE POEMS I WROTE BEFORE THE COMMODE.

TELL ME ABOUT THAT AND WHAT WILL MAKE YOU READY TO WRITE AGAIN.

>> I SIMPLY WROTE ABOUT SO MANY STORIES THAT HAPPENED TO ME THAT I WISH THAT I HAD HAPPENED TO MY PEOPLE, FAMILY AND FRIENDS AND STUDENTS.

REALLY, I HAVE NOT WRITTEN A SINGLE POEM FOR FIVE MONTHS.

I AM LITERALLY RELIVING THE POEMS THAT I WROTE.

WHETHER IT IS ABOUT THE DESTRUCTION.

I WROTE A POEM ABOUT A FATHER WHO WENT OUT TO GET BREAD FOR HITS --HIS KIDS.

IT IS DIFFICULT FOR ME.

WHAT MORE EMOTIONS OR TRAUMA WILL I EXPERIENCE HAVING TO AGAIN?

THE HELP OF A JOURNALIST AND A WRITER --THE HOPE IS WHEN THEY TELL ABOUT A STORY, THE HOPE IS THAT THE WORLD WILL KNOW ABOUT IT AND TRY TO STOP IT.

I HAVE BEEN WATCHING THE POEMS HAPPENING AGAIN AND AGAIN.

THE STORIES I SHARED WITH YOU A FEW MONTHS AGO, HAPPENING AGAIN AND AGAIN AND WHAT WAS SHARED WITH THE PEOPLE ABOUT THE STARVATION AND GENOCIDE AND KILLING OF FAMILIES.

THEY ARE HAPPENING AGAIN.

WHAT IS THE POINT OF US TALKING ABOUT IT?

WHAT IS THE POINT OF WRITING ABOUT GENOCIDE OR THE HOLOCAUST?

WHAT IS THE POINT OF WRITING ABOUT THESE ATROCITIES?

AND FUN THESE ATROCITIES -- FUNDED THESE ATROCITIES?

>> I AM TOLD, THAT IS THE POINT.

THE INVESTIGATION.

KEEP WRITING BECAUSE ALL YOU HAVE RIGHT NOW.

AND IT IS UP TO THE GOVERNMENT TO STOP THIS.

SO YOU ARE DOING THE RIGHT THING.

KEEP WRITING.

>> CAN I ADD ONE SMALL POINT.

I HAVE A REQUEST TO THE JOURNALISTS, I HOPE THEY WILL TRY TO GO ON OF BOAT OR A SHIP TO GO TO GAZA.

>> THANK YOU.

WE APPRECIATE IT AND WE ARE INCREDIBLY ANGERED.

IT IS UNACCEPTABLE.

WE APPRECIATE IT.

THANK YOU VERY MUCH, MOSAB ABU TOHA.

>> THANK YOU, CHRISTIANE.

>> AND AN IMPORTANT REMINDER OF THE IMMENSE COURAGE IT TAKES TO KEEP TELLING THE STORIES AND WHY THE WORLD CONTINUES TO LISTEN.

>>> AND LOOKING AT THE UNCERTAIN FUTURE OF THE IRANIAN NUCLEAR PROGRAM, JOIN ME ON THE CONVERSATION WITH THE HEAD OF THE ATOMIC ENERGY ASSOCIATION AND SOUNDING THE ALARM ON THE CONSEQUENCES OF COMPROMISING NUCLEAR SAFETY.

>> THE COMPETENT IRANIAN AUTHORITIES HAVE CONFIRMED THAT THIS ENRICHMENT SITE HAS BEEN IMPACTED AND THERE ARE NO ELEVATED RADIATION LEVELS.

THEY ALSO HAVE REPORTED THAT, AT PRESENT, THESE SITES HAVE NOT BEEN IMPACTED.

>> THE DEVELOPMENT IS DEEPLY CONCERNING.

I HAVE REPEATEDLY STATED THAT NUCLEAR FACILITIES MUST NEVER BE ATTACKED REGARDLESS OF THE CONTEXT OR CIRCUMSTANCES.

AND BOTH PEOPLE AND THE ENVIRONMENT.

>> THAT IS IT FOR THE PROGRAM TONIGHT.

IF YOU WANT TO FIND OUT WHAT IS COMING UP ON THE SHOW EACH NIGHT, SIGN UP FOR OUR NEWSLETTER ON PBS.ORG/AMANPOUR.

THANK YOU FOR JOINING US.

JOIN US AGAIN TOMORROW NIGHT!